Self-Introduction: Vincenzo Di Biaggio
by Vincenzo Di Biaggio
Hi!
I am Vincenzo Di Biaggio, i live in San Salvo, (CH), Abruzzo, Italy (
beautifulst sea and landscapes :D )
I work in a small company that it works in the automotive (quality control)
I have studied until the 4 ' year of industrial and technical
institute, but I have achieved a certificate for webmastering.
I would want to participate to the translation of the documentation,
which it's a your choice.
I know the system linux much good, I php and know to realize Internet
web sites with xhtml, xml, xslt, php, msql and much moore. I love the
software open-source and the translation is useful also to improve my
English :°)
I hope that you will accept to me, I will be much happy!
--
______________________________
Vincenzo Di Biaggio
www.aniceweb.com
aniceweb.wordpress.com
______________________________
gpg fingerprint= 9F02 2634 E190 A640 14F1 6FCB 2928 1DF4 E8FD BFA2
17 years, 1 month
re: more wiki cleanup
by Jason
I started working on this today (27.mar.2007).
-Jason
>Here's a very simple task that we could use a new volunteer's help on
>--
>cleaning up our Meeting Minutes page and making sure all the meeting IRC
>logs and summaries that can be found in the list archives are there.
<snipped>
17 years, 1 month
FDSCo Meeting 2007-03-25 Summary
by Paul W. Frields
Remove this line, then fill in date above along with other details below
Attendees:
-----------
* Karsten Wade
* Paul Frields
* Dimitris Glezos
Absent:
* Bart Couvreur
* Bob Jensen
* John Babich
* Pavel Sadowski
Summary:
---------
* GSoC has extended their deadline until tomorrow, 2007-03-26. Karsten
is waiting to see what proposals come in. We expect at least a PDF
proposal at this point.
* Paul has revamped docs-common; docs writers and editors should be
updating that module. Paul will work on converting existing XML
"snippets" from docs-common/common to PO, removing repetitive graphics
content in favor of SVG only + tools, and reverting repository-wide CVS
behavior to using "xml2po -k" so entity changes do not cause spurious
translation statistic changes.
* Dimitris will enter and track a request ticket on getting a
translation stats cron job and a host to run it on from Infrastructure.
No committee votes taken.
--
Paul W. Frields, RHCE http://paul.frields.org/
gpg fingerprint: 3DA6 A0AC 6D58 FEC4 0233 5906 ACDB C937 BD11 3717
Fedora Project: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/PaulWFrields
irc.freenode.net: stickster @ #fedora-docs, #fedora-devel, #fredlug
17 years, 1 month
FDSCo Meeting 2007-03-25 IRC log
by Paul W. Frields
Sorry for the last message, here's the proper thread title for archive
happiness.
12:13 < quaid> ok
12:13 * stickster just updated page with his item
12:13 < stickster> http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/DocsProject/SteeringCommittee/Meetings?acti...
12:13 < stickster> crud, sorry
12:13 < quaid> the first is easy
12:13 < stickster> http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/DocsProject/SteeringCommittee/Meetings
12:13 < quaid> there isn't a GSoC update; aiui the deadline for entries was extended to tomorrow
12:13 < stickster> Ah OK
12:13 < quaid> and I don't have a view yet into what has been proposed
12:14 < glezos> and I don't have a decision yet whether i'll participate as a student.
12:14 < quaid> but it does look like, except for FDP, Fedora didn't get as many ideas up on pages for people to propose against
12:14 < quaid> kind of our usual, "How about you dream up something you'd like to do?"
12:14 < stickster> *sigh
12:15 < stickster> I think the Board will need to start proactively dealing with this better in 2008
12:15 < quaid> hey, you know, if all we had to do was put out GNOME or something, then maybe we'd have time for niceties :)
12:15 < stickster> And to do that, we need a better planning system. I think there was an unfortunately short thread on a better project-wide calendaring system in one of the lists
12:15 < glezos> stickster, right
12:16 < quaid> ok, we can move on
12:16 < stickster> All right, my item next, yes?
12:16 < stickster> So, obviously if you look at f-docs-commits you'll see I've spent a bunch of time in Makefile.common recently
12:17 < stickster> We are now set up so people can check out single documents as a module, and automatically get docs-common included.
12:17 < quaid> but this is docs-common at ,/ v. ../?
12:17 < stickster> Things should Just Work(TM) regardless of whether you do that, or mirror the whole repository down
12:17 < stickster> gotcha!
12:17 < quaid> :)
12:18 < quaid> ok, so you dealt with the concern about multiple docs-common copies/
12:18 < stickster> You'll see the "find-common-dir" near the top (or some name like that, can't recall off the top of my head)
12:18 < stickster> It looks in current dir first, then parents up, then looks for a system dir in case we ever get around to packaging it
12:18 < quaid> ok
12:18 * quaid kicks CVS for not supporting symlinks
12:18 < stickster> Boo-ya!
12:18 < stickster> Nah, symlinks bad for people using Windowsw
12:18 < stickster> s/sw$/s/
12:19 < quaid> ?
12:19 < quaid> and the rest of it works on Windows?
12:19 < glezos> stickster, :)
12:19 < stickster> Well, cygwin
12:19 < quaid> well, as long as you got it to work
12:19 < stickster> OK, and...
12:20 < quaid> If it had to be a choice, cygwin would lose out
12:20 < stickster> sure
12:20 < stickster> But I think symlinks are generally a bad way of doing things anyway
12:20 < stickster> fragile
12:20 < stickster> So...
12:20 < stickster> 2. entities
12:20 < stickster> The entities files originally in docs-common/common/ are now gone (fdp-entities-<LANG>.ent)
12:21 < stickster> They were useless anyway, a pain for translators, and mostly stale
12:21 < stickster> All system wide entities have migrated to docs-common/common/entities/ using PO, the way that God intended
12:21 < stickster> Next up, I'm going to do the same for docs-common/common/ snippets like bugreporting, legalnotice, etc.
12:21 < quaid> ah, good, ok
12:22 < stickster> hang on , brb
12:22 * quaid saw cruft and didn't know which was cruft and which was gold
12:29 * quaid gets distracted in EPEL SIG meeting
12:29 < quaid> I got the new CVS bits and didn't have any questions so far
12:29 < quaid> but this is good because it simplifies the l10n process
12:30 < quaid> should we have the QSTG updated?
12:31 < quaid> or maybe wait until things settle down some more?
12:32 < glezos> dunno
12:33 < stickster> back
12:33 < glezos> quaid, I'd say that we could wait to get it done right
12:33 < glezos> It's 2 months more
12:34 < stickster> It won't be nearly that long before I have everything done
12:34 < stickster> In the next few days, after I'm done, I'll update it
12:34 < stickster> *: I also want to bring up the whole "xml2po -e" vs. "xml2po -k" thing
12:34 < stickster> I think we're better off with the latter.
12:35 < stickster> We tried it before but it didn't work because of the stupid stuff in docs-common/common/ (i.e. snippet inclusion without XInclude)
12:35 < stickster> I think we can safely go back to keeping entities in the POT/PO files now
12:35 < stickster> That means that translators will simply translate, e.g. &DISTRO; as &DISTRO;
12:36 < stickster> If we update one of them, like the Fedora release number, the translation doesn't immediately catch "the fuzzies"
12:36 < glezos> stickster, whatever you believe it's better
12:36 < stickster> Yeah, we tried to do it this way before, and fell back because we couldn't make it work
12:37 < stickster> Now we have more XML savvy and fewer crazy things we're trying to do, so things like that should now be possible again
12:38 < quaid> ok, cool
12:38 < quaid> stickster: good work, padewan
12:38 < stickster> Oh, one more thing
12:39 < stickster> I'm putting per-branch aliases in CVSROOT/modules, so you can now check out, e.g. "install-guide-devel" to get just the devel branch. It cuts down on bandwidth as well
12:39 < stickster> So, next up:
12:39 < stickster> 1. fixing snippets => XML+PO
12:39 < stickster> 2. fixing graphics => SVG+[tools]
12:40 < quaid> GuGu: we're meeting here for the next 20 minutes (or so); do you want to save your question(s) until then, then we can talk here?
12:40 < quaid> stickster: sorry, what are snippets?
12:41 < stickster> quaid: bugreporting-*.xml, legalnotice-*.xml, etc.
12:42 < stickster> all found in docs-common/common/ right now
12:42 < quaid> ah, right, those
12:42 * quaid forgot the special term 'snippet'
12:42 < quaid> ;-D
12:43 < stickster> OK, I'm done too
12:43 < stickster> couf_away is still away, so we can safely skip his item
12:44 < glezos> I have a suggestion
12:45 < glezos> that might urge translators get more Docs translated for F7
12:45 < glezos> if we had on the web some l10n statistics for cvs.fp.org, that might urge them to push their translation too
12:46 < quaid> hmm
12:46 < quaid> can we do that semi-manually?
12:46 < stickster> boo, hiss
12:46 < quaid> that is, write some Perl that dumps stats to SVG?
12:46 < stickster> heh
12:46 < quaid> err
12:46 < glezos> Sonar_Gal, would it be a good idea to ask FIP for a place to run the http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/DocsProject/Translation#statistics
12:46 < quaid> Python I meant
12:46 < stickster> Poor Sonar_Gal
12:47 < quaid> her fault, if she chose Sonar_Gyrl, then Sonar_Guy would get all the "So[tab]"
12:47 < glezos> quaid, we could do a cron job to run this script and publish the results.. they are not pretty, but they are usable... Especially if you run them through a search-n-replace script that transforms them into an HTML table...
12:47 < quaid> +1
12:47 < quaid> at least that
12:48 < quaid> maybe an update hourly (or at :20 or something)
12:48 < glezos> quaid, should we ask FIP for l10n.fedoraproject.org?
12:48 < stickster> And translation.fp.o
12:48 < quaid> as a CNAME?
12:48 < stickster> whatever
12:49 * stickster doesn't trust people to guess "l10n"
12:49 < quaid> ok, whatever, I mena, as a pointer v. stand alone host
12:49 < stickster> Oh yeah
12:49 < quaid> then I want documentation.fp.o !
12:49 < quaid> :D
12:49 < glezos> ok.. we could standarize on translations.fedoraproject.org and take it from there.. I guess this is something -trans-list should decide
12:49 < stickster> +1!
12:49 * quaid is all about the "docs is unprofesional, spell it out" :)
12:50 < quaid> glezos: yes, propose and see what they prefer, just as we did for docs.fp.o and then we'll put up what we have as we hae it
12:52 < glezos> k. then I'll just send an email to FIP
12:53 < quaid> cool, or file a ticket
12:53 < quaid> if there is nothing to discuss, just request
12:54 < quaid> (http://admin.fedoraproject.org/tickets)
12:54 < quaid> and there we go
12:54 < quaid> anything more here?
12:55 < glezos> nah
12:55 < stickster> nope
12:55 < quaid> heh, no quorum even
12:55 < quaid> rockin', thx getns
12:55 < quaid> gents even
12:55 < quaid> </meeting>
--
Paul W. Frields, RHCE http://paul.frields.org/
gpg fingerprint: 3DA6 A0AC 6D58 FEC4 0233 5906 ACDB C937 BD11 3717
Fedora Project: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/PaulWFrields
irc.freenode.net: stickster @ #fedora-docs, #fedora-devel, #fredlug
17 years, 1 month
FDSCo Meeting YYYY-MM-DD IRC log
by Paul W. Frields
12:13 < quaid> ok
12:13 * stickster just updated page with his item
12:13 < stickster>
http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/DocsProject/SteeringCommittee/Meetings?acti...
12:13 < stickster> crud, sorry
12:13 < quaid> the first is easy
12:13 < stickster>
http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/DocsProject/SteeringCommittee/Meetings
12:13 < quaid> there isn't a GSoC update; aiui the deadline for entries
was extended to tomorrow
12:13 < stickster> Ah OK
12:13 < quaid> and I don't have a view yet into what has been proposed
12:14 < glezos> and I don't have a decision yet whether i'll participate
as a student.
12:14 < quaid> but it does look like, except for FDP, Fedora didn't get
as many ideas up on pages for people to propose against
12:14 < quaid> kind of our usual, "How about you dream up something
you'd like to do?"
12:14 < stickster> *sigh
12:15 < stickster> I think the Board will need to start proactively
dealing with this better in 2008
12:15 < quaid> hey, you know, if all we had to do was put out GNOME or
something, then maybe we'd have time for niceties :)
12:15 < stickster> And to do that, we need a better planning system. I
think there was an unfortunately short thread on a better project-wide
calendaring system in one of the lists
12:15 < glezos> stickster, right
12:16 < quaid> ok, we can move on
12:16 < stickster> All right, my item next, yes?
12:16 < stickster> So, obviously if you look at f-docs-commits you'll
see I've spent a bunch of time in Makefile.common recently
12:17 < stickster> We are now set up so people can check out single
documents as a module, and automatically get docs-common included.
12:17 < quaid> but this is docs-common at ,/ v. ../?
12:17 < stickster> Things should Just Work(TM) regardless of whether you
do that, or mirror the whole repository down
12:17 < stickster> gotcha!
12:17 < quaid> :)
12:18 < quaid> ok, so you dealt with the concern about multiple
docs-common copies/
12:18 < stickster> You'll see the "find-common-dir" near the top (or
some name like that, can't recall off the top of my head)
12:18 < stickster> It looks in current dir first, then parents up, then
looks for a system dir in case we ever get around to packaging it
12:18 < quaid> ok
12:18 * quaid kicks CVS for not supporting symlinks
12:18 < stickster> Boo-ya!
12:18 < stickster> Nah, symlinks bad for people using Windowsw
12:18 < stickster> s/sw$/s/
12:19 < quaid> ?
12:19 < quaid> and the rest of it works on Windows?
12:19 < glezos> stickster, :)
12:19 < stickster> Well, cygwin
12:19 < quaid> well, as long as you got it to work
12:19 < stickster> OK, and...
12:20 < quaid> If it had to be a choice, cygwin would lose out
12:20 < stickster> sure
12:20 < stickster> But I think symlinks are generally a bad way of doing
things anyway
12:20 < stickster> fragile
12:20 < stickster> So...
12:20 < stickster> 2. entities
12:20 < stickster> The entities files originally in docs-common/common/
are now gone (fdp-entities-<LANG>.ent)
12:21 < stickster> They were useless anyway, a pain for translators, and
mostly stale
12:21 < stickster> All system wide entities have migrated to
docs-common/common/entities/ using PO, the way that God intended
12:21 < stickster> Next up, I'm going to do the same for
docs-common/common/ snippets like bugreporting, legalnotice, etc.
12:21 < quaid> ah, good, ok
12:22 < stickster> hang on , brb
12:22 * quaid saw cruft and didn't know which was cruft and which was
gold
12:29 * quaid gets distracted in EPEL SIG meeting
12:29 < quaid> I got the new CVS bits and didn't have any questions so
far
12:29 < quaid> but this is good because it simplifies the l10n process
12:30 < quaid> should we have the QSTG updated?
12:31 < quaid> or maybe wait until things settle down some more?
12:32 < glezos> dunno
12:33 < stickster> back
12:33 < glezos> quaid, I'd say that we could wait to get it done right
12:33 < glezos> It's 2 months more
12:34 < stickster> It won't be nearly that long before I have everything
done
12:34 < stickster> In the next few days, after I'm done, I'll update it
12:34 < stickster> *: I also want to bring up the whole "xml2po -e" vs.
"xml2po -k" thing
12:34 < stickster> I think we're better off with the latter.
12:35 < stickster> We tried it before but it didn't work because of the
stupid stuff in docs-common/common/ (i.e. snippet inclusion without
XInclude)
12:35 < stickster> I think we can safely go back to keeping entities in
the POT/PO files now
12:35 < stickster> That means that translators will simply translate,
e.g. &DISTRO; as &DISTRO;
12:36 < stickster> If we update one of them, like the Fedora release
number, the translation doesn't immediately catch "the fuzzies"
12:36 < glezos> stickster, whatever you believe it's better
12:36 < stickster> Yeah, we tried to do it this way before, and fell
back because we couldn't make it work
12:37 < stickster> Now we have more XML savvy and fewer crazy things
we're trying to do, so things like that should now be possible again
12:38 < quaid> ok, cool
12:38 < quaid> stickster: good work, padewan
12:38 < stickster> Oh, one more thing
12:39 < stickster> I'm putting per-branch aliases in CVSROOT/modules, so
you can now check out, e.g. "install-guide-devel" to get just the devel
branch. It cuts down on bandwidth as well
12:39 < stickster> So, next up:
12:39 < stickster> 1. fixing snippets => XML+PO
12:39 < stickster> 2. fixing graphics => SVG+[tools]
12:40 < quaid> GuGu: we're meeting here for the next 20 minutes (or so);
do you want to save your question(s) until then, then we can talk here?
12:40 < quaid> stickster: sorry, what are snippets?
12:41 < stickster> quaid: bugreporting-*.xml, legalnotice-*.xml, etc.
12:42 < stickster> all found in docs-common/common/ right now
12:42 < quaid> ah, right, those
12:42 * quaid forgot the special term 'snippet'
12:42 < quaid> ;-D
12:43 < stickster> OK, I'm done too
12:43 < stickster> couf_away is still away, so we can safely skip his
item
12:44 < glezos> I have a suggestion
12:45 < glezos> that might urge translators get more Docs translated for
F7
12:45 < glezos> if we had on the web some l10n statistics for
cvs.fp.org, that might urge them to push their translation too
12:46 < quaid> hmm
12:46 < quaid> can we do that semi-manually?
12:46 < stickster> boo, hiss
12:46 < quaid> that is, write some Perl that dumps stats to SVG?
12:46 < stickster> heh
12:46 < quaid> err
12:46 < glezos> Sonar_Gal, would it be a good idea to ask FIP for a
place to run the
http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/DocsProject/Translation#statistics
12:46 < quaid> Python I meant
12:46 < stickster> Poor Sonar_Gal
12:47 < quaid> her fault, if she chose Sonar_Gyrl, then Sonar_Guy would
get all the "So[tab]"
12:47 < glezos> quaid, we could do a cron job to run this script and
publish the results.. they are not pretty, but they are usable...
Especially if you run them through a search-n-replace script that
transforms them into an HTML table...
12:47 < quaid> +1
12:47 < quaid> at least that
12:48 < quaid> maybe an update hourly (or at :20 or something)
12:48 < glezos> quaid, should we ask FIP for l10n.fedoraproject.org?
12:48 < stickster> And translation.fp.o
12:48 < quaid> as a CNAME?
12:48 < stickster> whatever
12:49 * stickster doesn't trust people to guess "l10n"
12:49 < quaid> ok, whatever, I mena, as a pointer v. stand alone host
12:49 < stickster> Oh yeah
12:49 < quaid> then I want documentation.fp.o !
12:49 < quaid> :D
12:49 < glezos> ok.. we could standarize on
translations.fedoraproject.org and take it from there.. I guess this is
something -trans-list should decide
12:49 < stickster> +1!
12:49 * quaid is all about the "docs is unprofesional, spell it out" :)
12:50 < quaid> glezos: yes, propose and see what they prefer, just as we
did for docs.fp.o and then we'll put up what we have as we hae it
12:52 < glezos> k. then I'll just send an email to FIP
12:53 < quaid> cool, or file a ticket
12:53 < quaid> if there is nothing to discuss, just request
12:54 < quaid> (http://admin.fedoraproject.org/tickets)
12:54 < quaid> and there we go
12:54 < quaid> anything more here?
12:55 < glezos> nah
12:55 < stickster> nope
12:55 < quaid> heh, no quorum even
12:55 < quaid> rockin', thx getns
12:55 < quaid> gents even
12:55 < quaid> </meeting>
--
Paul W. Frields, RHCE http://paul.frields.org/
gpg fingerprint: 3DA6 A0AC 6D58 FEC4 0233 5906 ACDB C937 BD11 3717
Fedora Project: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/PaulWFrields
irc.freenode.net: stickster @ #fedora-docs, #fedora-devel, #fredlug
17 years, 1 month
GSoC: Publishing man/info pages
by MBurns
Hi all,
I'm interested in working on one of the Fedora bounties, specifically the
'publishing man pages' project [1]. For those that might not know, the
project is to have an automated way to grab all the man and info pages from
a release and put them on the web to be searched and browsed online.
Extending that, putting the documentation into a wiki system is also
possible (and open some interesting opportunities, in my eyes).
I was wondering what some of the groups thoughts and goals of this project
might be. Both so that ideas can be brought out early, but also to know what
I might be getting myself into :)
So I pose the questions:
*Would you like to see man/info pages be online? (broken down by release
version, etc, or not)
*Would you want them in a wiki?
*What about pushing changes on the wiki back to the maintainers of the
respective packages?
*Would this be a welcome addition or just more work?
*What would you like to see this project accomplish in terms of Fedora
Documentation? (hopefully beyond just googling for a man page and having it
return a fedoraproject.org URL)
Cheers!
[1] http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/FedoraBounties#head-f4affa8058dbc6a6b0568c3...
--
Michael Burns * Open Source Lab
Oregon State University
17 years, 1 month
Re: DUG Review
by Rahul Sundaram
Timothy Murphy wrote:
>
> My conclusion is that the DUG editors,
> as some others associated with Fedora,
> are pushing Gnome for essentially "political" reasons,
> rather than out of any consideration for prospective users.
I think it has been amply clarified that this in not the case now.
Looking forward to your contributions.
Rahul
17 years, 1 month
your thoughts on screenshots?
by Karsten Wade
I was explaining something this morning that I thought all could benefit
from. I want to convince writers to avoid using screenshots. What do
you think of this?
Here are the reasons:
* They are hard to translate.
* They have to be redone every time there is a change in the UI (string
or graphical change).
- This comes from the rule, "Make certain what you tell/show the
reader is 100% accurate to what they see on the screen, or the reader
loses trust in you."
- Changing text that refers to a UI is *much* easier to fix and
translate than the same change in a screenshot.
* They take up a lot of space on the screen/on paper.
* They don't show anything more than the reader is already looking at in
the application on their computer screen.
* At most, they confirm for the reader, "Yes, I see the same thing in
the documentation as I do on the screen, I am in the right place." This
can be done with words alone.
* A description of a screen takes up less space than a screenshot.
* Since we do not want our documents to be a catalog of what can be done
in a UI screen, we're never interested in everything visible to the
reader. We're interested in only a subset of what is in the UI.
Showing the entire UI in a screenshot is therefore distracting.
* A screenshot is not the same as a diagram or other useful graphic.
Okay, what are the advantages of using a screenshot?
* Useful if the reader cannot read the language of the document; the
screen shows them they are in the right place.
* Useful if the reader believes they cannot follow a document without
screenshots.
* Nice for desktop tours, to show what applications look like.
* Useful for when you need to define a specific term on the desktop, as
in the FDUG where the elements of the desktop are explained with a
graphic to show which piece it is.
I would like to make this part of our guidelines. What do you all
think?
- Karsten
--
Karsten Wade, RHCE, 108 Editor ^ Fedora Documentation Project
Sr. Developer Relations Mgr. | fedoraproject.org/wiki/DocsProject
quaid.108.redhat.com | gpg key: AD0E0C41
////////////////////////////////// \\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\
17 years, 1 month
