12:10 a.m.
I´ve got a wireless USB keyboard + optical mouse in a machine running Fedora
Core 2. Both devices are working perfectly. I can use the keyboard without
any problem but I´m having a little trouble with the mouse. The pointer
(cursor) moves perfectly -so the mouse is working- but I can´t click or use
the wheel. I don´t really care about the wheel too much but no button is
working. This doesn´t happen when I use a PS/2 optical mouse. And, finally,
under Windowshit XP (in the same machine) it works perfectly... so, is nos
the BIOS setting.
And of course I played for a while with kudzu and system-config-mouse.
What can I do? Is there a driver for that?
Thanks.
----------------------------------------------------------------
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8:16 a.m.
On Sun, 2004-07-25 at 01:10, pablo(a)hard-line.com.ar wrote:
I´ve got a wireless USB keyboard + optical mouse in a machine running
Fedora
Core 2. Both devices are working perfectly. I can use the keyboard without
any problem but I´m having a little trouble with the mouse. The pointer
(cursor) moves perfectly -so the mouse is working- but I can´t click or use
the wheel. I don´t really care about the wheel too much but no button is
working. This doesn´t happen when I use a PS/2 optical mouse. And, finally,
under Windowshit XP (in the same machine) it works perfectly... so, is nos
the BIOS setting.
And of course I played for a while with kudzu and system-config-mouse.
What can I do? Is there a driver for that?
Thanks.
This list, fedora-docs-list, is for discussing Fedora documentation, not
for technical help with Fedora. If you need technical assistance, you
want the fedora-list instead. Here's where you can find information on
that list, and search the archives before posting:
http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list/
Good luck and best wishes.
--
Paul W. Frields, RHCE
2:15 p.m.
On Sunday 25 July 2004 09:16 am, Paul W. Frields wrote:
> What can I do? Is there a driver for that?
> Thanks.
This list, fedora-docs-list, is for discussing Fedora documentation, not
for technical help with Fedora.
This issue arises frequently.
Perhaps it's time to look at it as a documentation issue.
What process did they arrive at in choosing this list?
How can we use the answer to improve the system and get those who need help to
the correct place on the first try?
--
Hoyt
Linux _is_ foolproof; just look at all the Windows users who won't use it.
9:07 a.m.
On Sun, 2004-07-25 at 15:15, Hoyt wrote:
> > What can I do? Is there a driver for that?
> > Thanks.
>
> This list, fedora-docs-list, is for discussing Fedora documentation, not
> for technical help with Fedora.
This issue arises frequently.
Perhaps it's time to look at it as a documentation issue.
What process did they arrive at in choosing this list?
How can we use the answer to improve the system and get those who need help to
the correct place on the first try?
The snarky answer would be "improve literacy throughout the user
community." But that's not really answering your question. ;-) I think a
good start would be for Red Hat to include a notation in their listinfo
pages for fedora-docs-list in a large, easy-to-read, highlighted box,
reading in effect:
"The fedora-docs-list is for discussion of Fedora documentation, *not*
for technical assistance. If you are looking for help with a Fedora
issue, such as how to accomplish a certain task, go to the
**fedora-list** [link] pages instead. Thank you!"
I think it's currently very easy for people to mistake one for the
other, because they think, "Aha, 'docs' -- that must be where I can find
HOWTOs and such." We need to learn that as the user community expands,
so too does the tendency to "think like a geek" drop concomitantly. I
don't think we'll ever arrive at a 100% success rate with getting the
right people to a solution on the first try, although it's certainly a
noble goal. But what we should *never* have is users flailing after the
second try -- that number should be 100% almost without exception, if
you get my meaning.
Cheers!
--
Paul W. Frields, RHCE
2:42 a.m.
On Sun, Jul 25, 2004 at 03:15:42PM -0400 or thereabouts, Hoyt wrote:
On Sunday 25 July 2004 09:16 am, Paul W. Frields wrote:
> This list, fedora-docs-list, is for discussing Fedora documentation, not
> for technical help with Fedora.
This issue arises frequently.
Perhaps it's time to look at it as a documentation issue.
What process did they arrive at in choosing this list?
"Ooh. Docs people will know the answer because they wrote a document
about it. They will certainly know where the document is."
We get this sort of thing on the Gnome docs list. But not nearly
as often. I don't know why it happens so often here.
Telsa
10:47 a.m.
New subject: People posting here by mistake (was:Re: Problems using a wireless mouse unfer FC2)
On Tuesday 27 July 2004 03:42 am, Telsa Gwynne wrote:
We get this sort of thing on the Gnome docs list. But not nearly
as often. I don't know why it happens so often here.
That's why I suggested asking the people how it was that they came to _this_
mail list.
I had a similar problem at my business, receiving ever-increasing phone calls
intended for a neighboring business with a similar name. At first, we just
assumed that it was name confusion, but when I asked these people how they
came upon my number, we were able to determine that an error in Verizon's
listing for 411 calls listed my number under my neighbors name. Without
asking, the problem would never have been solved.
--
Hoyt
A day without sunshine is a lot like night.
1:29 p.m.
New subject: People posting here by mistake (was:Re: Problems using a wireless mouse unfer FC2)
On Tue, 2004-07-27 at 08:47, Hoyt wrote:
On Tuesday 27 July 2004 03:42 am, Telsa Gwynne wrote:
> We get this sort of thing on the Gnome docs list. But not nearly
> as often. I don't know why it happens so often here.
That's why I suggested asking the people how it was that they came to _this_
mail list.
I had a similar problem at my business, receiving ever-increasing phone calls
intended for a neighboring business with a similar name. At first, we just
assumed that it was name confusion, but when I asked these people how they
came upon my number, we were able to determine that an error in Verizon's
listing for 411 calls listed my number under my neighbors name. Without
asking, the problem would never have been solved.
Following up on this theory, I looked around for an obvious
configuration or information bug at fedora.redhat.com and
www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-docs-list, and nothing jumps out
as a reason people would be lead to this list for generic questions.
For example, I looked to see if there was anywhere that fedora-docs-list
was described other than "participants of the Docs Project", and I
didn't find anything.
Next time we get such a question we'll have to ask how they found this
list for their answer.
--
Karsten Wade, RHCE, Tech Writer
this .signature subject to random changes
http://people.redhat.com/kwade/
gpg fingerprint: 2680 DBFD D968 3141 0115 5F1B D992 0E06 AD0E 0C41
2:46 p.m.
New subject: People posting here by mistake (was:Re: Problems using a wireless mouse unfer FC2)
Following up on this theory, I looked around for an obvious
configuration or information bug at fedora.redhat.com and
www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-docs-list, and nothing jumps out
as a reason people would be lead to this list for generic questions.
For example, I looked to see if there was anywhere that fedora-docs-list
was described other than "participants of the Docs Project", and I
didn't find anything.
Next time we get such a question we'll have to ask how they found this
list for their answer.
I would think we could take a couple proactive steps without adversely
affecting anyone:
1. In Elliot Lee's monthly (or however regular) list of Red Hat/Fedora
lists, the first listing appearing at the top, set off in some manner of
highlight, should be fedora-list. That would emphasize the importance of
that list for users, I think without disparaging any of the other lists.
(I could also see including fedora-devel-list with fedora-list; that
would probably be a judgment call for the Fedora leadership. I suspect
fedora-list sees more traffic, and undoubtedly is where we are
continually redirecting folks.)
2. The archive/info page for fedora-docs-list should include a
highlighted area that lets people know how fedora-docs-list differs from
fedora-list, and helpfully provides a link to fedora-list.
I'm copying Elliot on this message in case he's interested in at least
suggestion #1.
--
Paul W. Frields, RHCE
7:58 p.m.
New subject: People posting here by mistake (was:Re: Problems using a wireless mouse unfer FC2)
On Thu, 2004-07-29 at 12:46, Paul W. Frields wrote:
> Following up on this theory, I looked around for an obvious
> configuration or information bug at fedora.redhat.com and
> www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-docs-list, and nothing jumps out
> as a reason people would be lead to this list for generic questions.
> For example, I looked to see if there was anywhere that fedora-docs-list
> was described other than "participants of the Docs Project", and I
> didn't find anything.
>
> Next time we get such a question we'll have to ask how they found this
> list for their answer.
I would think we could take a couple proactive steps without adversely
affecting anyone:
1. In Elliot Lee's monthly (or however regular) list of Red Hat/Fedora
lists, the first listing appearing at the top, set off in some manner of
highlight, should be fedora-list. That would emphasize the importance of
that list for users, I think without disparaging any of the other lists.
(I could also see including fedora-devel-list with fedora-list; that
would probably be a judgment call for the Fedora leadership. I suspect
fedora-list sees more traffic, and undoubtedly is where we are
continually redirecting folks.)
2. The archive/info page for fedora-docs-list should include a
highlighted area that lets people know how fedora-docs-list differs from
fedora-list, and helpfully provides a link to fedora-list.
I'm copying Elliot on this message in case he's interested in at least
suggestion #1.
Just FYI for Elliot, I requested the list owner to make changes as per
#2, to the listinfo/ page and the welcome message.
- Karsten
--
Karsten Wade, RHCE, Tech Writer
this .signature subject to random changes
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7:18 p.m.
New subject: People posting here by mistake (was:Re: Problems using a wireless mouse unfer FC2)
Uttered Karsten Wade <kwade(a)redhat.com>, spake thus:
Following up on this theory, I looked around for an obvious
configuration or information bug at fedora.redhat.com and
www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-docs-list, and nothing jumps out
as a reason people would be lead to this list for generic questions.
I started with the http://fedora.redhat.com link and made my way to
http://fedora.redhat.com/projects/docs/
by clicking on the "Docs" button on the introductory page. Here the
Documentation Project is mentioned twice, with two links.
Unfortunately, there really no documentation available on this path,
but following the link gets me to the "Docs Project" page. Still no
user documentation, but nothing to indicate that real user-level
documentation isn't just another click or two away.
I suggest putting a notice on the "User Documentation" page there at
http://fedora.redhat.com/projects/docs/
these are now the pages to _obtain_ on-line documentation but the
place to _create_ it. Something along the lines of "no user
serviceable parts inside" message. Maybe "Do you want to be an
author? Join our mailing list!" would be sufficient.
Cheers!
7:55 p.m.
New subject: People posting here by mistake (was:Re: Problems using a wireless mouse unfer FC2)
On Thu, 2004-07-29 at 17:18, Tommy Reynolds wrote:
Uttered Karsten Wade <kwade(a)redhat.com>, spake thus:
> Following up on this theory, I looked around for an obvious
> configuration or information bug at fedora.redhat.com and
> www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-docs-list, and nothing jumps out
> as a reason people would be lead to this list for generic questions.
I started with the http://fedora.redhat.com link and made my way to
http://fedora.redhat.com/projects/docs/
by clicking on the "Docs" button on the introductory page. Here the
Documentation Project is mentioned twice, with two links.
Unfortunately, there really no documentation available on this path,
but following the link gets me to the "Docs Project" page. Still no
user documentation, but nothing to indicate that real user-level
documentation isn't just another click or two away.
I suggest putting a notice on the "User Documentation" page there at
http://fedora.redhat.com/projects/docs/
these are now the pages to _obtain_ on-line documentation but the
place to _create_ it. Something along the lines of "no user
serviceable parts inside" message. Maybe "Do you want to be an
author? Join our mailing list!" would be sufficient.
Good point, and exactly the type of concept disconnection we were
looking for.
Below I combined Tommy's and Paul's ideas, at least for the mailing
list. I don't know off hand how one goes about changing content on
fedora.redhat.com.
This is cc:'d the list owner. Warren, can we make changes to the
mailing list pages along these lines? Everyone, speak up to fix the
language here, or don't and let Warren make the changes verbatim:
http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-docs-list
Under "About fedora-docs-list":
"The Fedora Docs Project is for writers and testers of documentation for
Fedora Core. The fedora-docs-list is for writers to discuss
documentation. For technical answers information, use <a
href="http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list">fe...
I think the blurb on http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/, "For
participants of the docs project," is probably good enough.
If we really want to drive the point home, we can put this blurb in the
"welcome to the mailing list" message emailed to new subscribers. This
is a nice thing to do for people, letting them know right away what is
on-topic:
"Fedora-docs-list is for writers interested in creating and editing
documentation for Fedora Core. This is not the place to obtain
documentation or technical help, other than help using the Fedora Docs
Project toolchain. If you need help using Fedora Core, use fedora-list;
subscribe at http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list."
## 30
- Karsten
--
Karsten Wade, RHCE, Tech Writer
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http://people.redhat.com/kwade/
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6:53 a.m.
New subject: People posting here by mistake (was:Re: Problems using a wireless mouse unfer FC2)
On Thu, 2004-07-29 at 20:55, Karsten Wade wrote:
[...snip...]
This is cc:'d the list owner. Warren, can we make changes to
the
mailing list pages along these lines? Everyone, speak up to fix the
language here, or don't and let Warren make the changes verbatim:
http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-docs-list
Under "About fedora-docs-list":
"The Fedora Docs Project is for writers and testers of documentation for
Fedora Core. The fedora-docs-list is for writers to discuss
documentation. For technical answers information, use <a
^^^^ and/or?
href="http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list">fe...
I think the blurb on http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/, "For
participants of the docs project," is probably good enough.
I can live with that; this is kind of an incremental process in any
case, so there's no reason to go overboard on changing every reference
to fedora-docs-list at once. If we're still getting a third of our
threads devoted to out-of-band issues three or six months down the road
we could make additional changes.
If we really want to drive the point home, we can put this blurb in
the
"welcome to the mailing list" message emailed to new subscribers. This
is a nice thing to do for people, letting them know right away what is
on-topic:
"Fedora-docs-list is for writers interested in creating and editing
documentation for Fedora Core. This is not the place to obtain
documentation or technical help, other than help using the Fedora Docs
Project toolchain. If you need help using Fedora Core, use fedora-list;
subscribe at http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list."
I would surround "This is not the place..." with <em> or <i> just
to
make sure it's read. Looks good!
--
Paul W. Frields, RHCE
4:45 p.m.
New subject: People posting here by mistake (was:Re: Problems using a wireless mouse unfer FC2)
On Fri, 2004-07-30 at 04:53, Paul W. Frields wrote:
On Thu, 2004-07-29 at 20:55, Karsten Wade wrote:
>
> "Fedora-docs-list is for writers interested in creating and editing
> documentation for Fedora Core. This is not the place to obtain
> documentation or technical help, other than help using the Fedora Docs
> Project toolchain. If you need help using Fedora Core, use fedora-list;
> subscribe at http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list."
I would surround "This is not the place..." with <em> or <i> just
to
make sure it's read. Looks good!
How about <blink /> tags? :-D
Un*fortunately, the welcome email is plain text, so we'll have to make
sure the wording is emphasis enough.
- Karsten
* well, it's not really unfortunate.
--
Karsten Wade, RHCE, Tech Writer
this .signature subject to random changes
http://people.redhat.com/kwade/
gpg fingerprint: 2680 DBFD D968 3141 0115 5F1B D992 0E06 AD0E 0C41
5:26 p.m.
New subject: People posting here by mistake (was:Re: Problems using a wireless mouse unfer FC2)
On Fri, 2004-07-30 at 17:45, Karsten Wade wrote:
> I would surround "This is not the place..." with
<em> or <i> just to
> make sure it's read. Looks good!
How about <blink /> tags? :-D
Un*fortunately, the welcome email is plain text, so we'll have to make
sure the wording is emphasis enough.
Yeah, more blinking... and red, can we have red? Or cornflower blue? :-D
In meager defense, I was only talking about on the Web page for
fedora-docs-list. But to paraphrase earlier sentiments, you can lead a
horse to water, etc....
--
Paul W. Frields, RHCE
7208
days inactive
7213
days old
13 comments
6 participants
participants (6)
-
Hoyt -
Karsten Wade -
Pablo -
Paul W. Frields -
Telsa Gwynne -
Tommy Reynolds