Please everyone... I am not trolling or trying to start a debate. I am just stating my own very personal views with the following.
I will start and end with the same statement.
My comments here in no way reflects the exceptionally good work and repsonsiveness of Fedora's KDE Team.
This is the first time that I can remember that I am not looking forward to the next release of Fedora.
I have done a bit of fiddeling with plasma 5 and I must say as a long time KDE user I will not be upgrading to Plasma 5 on my main office or home systems given its current state. It is buggy, missing many features that I have become accustommed to and I have no way to work around the issues.
While the individual issues that I have discovered may be minor, add them all up together with all the problems and issues that have been posted recently means some obstruction to my work flow.
I will list the problems:
no screensaver clock on the system tray takes up way to much realestate resizing windows causes my windows to black until I click the app on the task switcher to minimze and then restore I cannot set my regional settings to the country where I live without changing the language of interface. I want it to remain english. kdepim has not been ported to the new library set yet. The text contrast kicker cannot be altered. The American flag for the keyboard switcher is distorted
Like I said these issues are minor, but these issues are a reflection of a very very cursive look. I would hate to see what I would find if I did some real QA on it.
Again, my comments here in no way reflects the exceptionally good work and repsonsiveness of Fedora's KDE Team. I am looking forward to when Plasma 5 becomes more feature complete and stable. I am very confident that the Fedora KDE team will get those out to us as soon as those positive changes will become available.
Thanks for listening :)
Eli
On 05/11/15 16:15, Eli Wapniarski wrote:
Please everyone... I am not trolling or trying to start a debate. I am just stating my own very personal views with the following.
I will start and end with the same statement.
My comments here in no way reflects the exceptionally good work and repsonsiveness of Fedora's KDE Team.
This is the first time that I can remember that I am not looking forward to the next release of Fedora.
I have done a bit of fiddeling with plasma 5 and I must say as a long time KDE user I will not be upgrading to Plasma 5 on my main office or home systems given its current state. It is buggy, missing many features that I have become accustommed to and I have no way to work around the issues.
Totally agree and I've pretty much, I think, stated the same in an earlier email.
While the individual issues that I have discovered may be minor, add them all up together with all the problems and issues that have been posted recently means some obstruction to my work flow.
I will list the problems:
no screensaver clock on the system tray takes up way to much realestate resizing windows causes my windows to black until I click the app on the task switcher to minimze and then restore I cannot set my regional settings to the country where I live without changing the language of interface. I want it to remain english. kdepim has not been ported to the new library set yet. The text contrast kicker cannot be altered. The American flag for the keyboard switcher is distorted
Allow me to add to your list....
Starting from a "Saved Session" doesn't work. The windows may be restored, but they are never in the location you've saved them. And, they all end up on a single virtual desktop. And the systray may or may not be at the height you previously specified. And, even if you save a session and you want to start with Virtual Desktop 2 displayed, you'll get Virtual Desktop 1.
The default window size for konsole aren't always retained between login sessions. Sometimes I get the 82x24 I want, and sometimes I don't.
I can't define the date/time format for the systray clock that I want. I want 24hr format an mm/dd/yy.
The "upgrade" to Plasma 5 should be "seamless" in that your themes and decorations are retained. User installed themes are in a new location but not moved in the "upgrade" process. Users will have to spend time to redo their environment. If they have many systems they may get annoyed.
You can't have a different wallpaper for each Virtual Desktop. This makes life boring.
There is no kwallet manager for Plasma 5 at this time....or so I've been told.
And, of course, the crashes I've noted in my "Basic Plasma 5 Crashes" email.
Like I said these issues are minor, but these issues are a reflection of a very very cursive look. I would hate to see what I would find if I did some real QA on it.
I guess most are minor but the window placement/size issue it really annoying. I'm seriously considering staying with F21 with the hope that F23 will be better.
Again, my comments here in no way reflects the exceptionally good work and repsonsiveness of Fedora's KDE Team. I am looking forward to when Plasma 5 becomes more feature complete and stable. I am very confident that the Fedora KDE team will get those out to us as soon as those positive changes will become available.
Thanks for listening :)
Same here.... And I hope someone does actually listen. :-) :-)
Hi,
let me try to address some of the issues you and Eli raised here
On Monday, May 11, 2015 04:59:38 PM Ed Greshko wrote:
On 05/11/15 16:15, Eli Wapniarski wrote:
Please everyone... I am not trolling or trying to start a debate. I am just stating my own very personal views with the following.
I will start and end with the same statement.
My comments here in no way reflects the exceptionally good work and repsonsiveness of Fedora's KDE Team.
This is the first time that I can remember that I am not looking forward to the next release of Fedora.
I have done a bit of fiddeling with plasma 5 and I must say as a long time KDE user I will not be upgrading to Plasma 5 on my main office or home systems given its current state. It is buggy, missing many features that I have become accustommed to and I have no way to work around the issues.
Totally agree and I've pretty much, I think, stated the same in an earlier email.
While the individual issues that I have discovered may be minor, add them all up together with all the problems and issues that have been posted recently means some obstruction to my work flow.
I will list the problems:
no screensaver
clock on the system tray takes up way to much realestate
Digital or analog clock? With date or without? I use digital clock with date and it really only takes the minimum necessary space.
resizing windows causes my windows to black until I click the app on the task switcher to minimze and then restore
Hmm, could be a driver issue? Have you tried with KWin effects disabled (Alt +Shift+F12)?
I cannot set my regional settings to the country where I live without changing the language of interface I want it to remain english.
Is System Settings -> Regional Settings -> Formats what you are looking for? This does only affect time, currency etc. format, but not the actual language of the UI.
kdepim has not been ported to the new library set yet.
I don't see how this is a problem :-) We are going to release Qt5/KF5-based KDE PIM in August with KDE Applications 15.08 and our aim is for users not to be able to tell any difference between KDE 4 and KF5 version.
The text contrast kicker cannot be altered.
The American flag for the keyboard switcher is distorted
That's the old (KDE 4) keyboard switcher, probably shown because you had some old KDED modules from KDE 4 still installed or loaded. In pure Plasma 5 environment the layout switcher only says "us" or "cz" etc.
Allow me to add to your list....
Starting from a "Saved Session" doesn't work. The windows may be restored, but they are never in the location you've saved them. And, they all end up on a single virtual desktop. And the systray may or may not be at the height you previously specified. And, even if you save a session and you want to start with Virtual Desktop 2 displayed, you'll get Virtual Desktop
Yes, this is a big issue :(
The default window size for konsole aren't always retained between login sessions. Sometimes I get the 82x24 I want, and sometimes I don't.
I think this might be related to the above :(
I can't define the date/time format for the systray clock that I want. I want 24hr format an mm/dd/yy.
We could add the to the configuration UI, or you could try to change that in regional and datetime settings.
The "upgrade" to Plasma 5 should be "seamless" in that your themes and decorations are retained. User installed themes are in a new location but not moved in the "upgrade" process. Users will have to spend time to redo their environment. If they have many systems they may get annoyed.
In most cases that is not possible, as Oxygen Plasma 5 itself looks very differently from Oxygen in KDE 4 (+ Breeze is now the default), and most 3rd party themes and decorations don't provide Qt 5 versions yet, so what actually happens is fallback to default.
Plus there were some major changings in the internals of Plasma, so the devs decided that it will be safer to not migrate the shell configuration (basically, it's better not to migrate anything than to migrate only something and break stuff).
You can't have a different wallpaper for each Virtual Desktop. This makes life boring.
I think this is planned for 5.4 :)
There is no kwallet manager for Plasma 5 at this time....or so I've been told.
Jan is working on it, KWalletManager5 should hit repos in time for F22.
And, of course, the crashes I've noted in my "Basic Plasma 5 Crashes" email.
Like I said these issues are minor, but these issues are a reflection of a very very cursive look. I would hate to see what I would find if I did some real QA on it.
I guess most are minor but the window placement/size issue it really annoying. I'm seriously considering staying with F21 with the hope that F23 will be better.
Again, my comments here in no way reflects the exceptionally good work and repsonsiveness of Fedora's KDE Team. I am looking forward to when Plasma 5 becomes more feature complete and stable. I am very confident that the Fedora KDE team will get those out to us as soon as those positive changes will become available.
Thanks for listening :)
Same here.... And I hope someone does actually listen. :-) :-)
I know this is an old cliche, but upstream is always willing to listen, so reporting those issues directly to upstream gives you higher chance of seeing those issues resolved. We can do some smaller patches here and there but most issues is unfortunatelly too much for us (mostly due to lack of time).
Cheerios, Dan
On 05/11/15 17:37, Daniel Vrátil wrote:
I can't define the date/time format for the systray clock that I want. I want 24hr format an mm/dd/yy.
We could add the to the configuration UI, or you could try to change that in regional and datetime settings.
Well, there is no locale which gets you 24hr format and US style mm/dd/yy. There are those that get you 24hr but they all have dd/mm/yy. Even LC_TIME=C is that way. :-(
I've failed to find a procedure, that works, to define and install a custom locale. If that was available....
The "upgrade" to Plasma 5 should be "seamless" in that your themes and decorations are retained. User installed themes are in a new location but not moved in the "upgrade" process. Users will have to spend time to redo their environment. If they have many systems they may get annoyed.
In most cases that is not possible, as Oxygen Plasma 5 itself looks very differently from Oxygen in KDE 4 (+ Breeze is now the default), and most 3rd party themes and decorations don't provide Qt 5 versions yet, so what actually happens is fallback to default.
Plus there were some major changings in the internals of Plasma, so the devs decided that it will be safer to not migrate the shell configuration (basically, it's better not to migrate anything than to migrate only something and break stuff).
OK.... Short term pain I suppose. It took me a while to find a theme that I liked and "worked". Many of the themes look nice but fail to display the NetworkManager icons to set "Airplane Mode" and turn on/off Wireless. Breeze, IMHO, is pretty ugly. :-)
Ed Greshko composed on 2015-05-11 18:00 (UTC+0800):
Breeze, IMHO, is pretty ugly. :-)
Quoting myself from another mailing list in re Breeze:
worst ever experienced default theme
It's even worse than that looked at in the context of the prior default Elarun being among best ever experienced anywhere.
Daniel Vrátil venit, vidit, dixit 11.05.2015 11:37:
Hi,
let me try to address some of the issues you and Eli raised here
On Monday, May 11, 2015 04:59:38 PM Ed Greshko wrote:
On 05/11/15 16:15, Eli Wapniarski wrote:
Please everyone... I am not trolling or trying to start a debate. I am just stating my own very personal views with the following.
I will start and end with the same statement.
My comments here in no way reflects the exceptionally good work and repsonsiveness of Fedora's KDE Team.
This is the first time that I can remember that I am not looking forward to the next release of Fedora.
I have done a bit of fiddeling with plasma 5 and I must say as a long time KDE user I will not be upgrading to Plasma 5 on my main office or home systems given its current state. It is buggy, missing many features that I have become accustommed to and I have no way to work around the issues.
Totally agree and I've pretty much, I think, stated the same in an earlier email.
While the individual issues that I have discovered may be minor, add them all up together with all the problems and issues that have been posted recently means some obstruction to my work flow.
I will list the problems:
no screensaver
clock on the system tray takes up way to much realestate
Digital or analog clock? With date or without? I use digital clock with date and it really only takes the minimum necessary space.
resizing windows causes my windows to black until I click the app on the task switcher to minimze and then restore
Hmm, could be a driver issue? Have you tried with KWin effects disabled (Alt +Shift+F12)?
I cannot set my regional settings to the country where I live without changing the language of interface I want it to remain english.
Is System Settings -> Regional Settings -> Formats what you are looking for? This does only affect time, currency etc. format, but not the actual language of the UI.
kdepim has not been ported to the new library set yet.
I don't see how this is a problem :-) We are going to release Qt5/KF5-based KDE PIM in August with KDE Applications 15.08 and our aim is for users not to be able to tell any difference between KDE 4 and KF5 version.
The text contrast kicker cannot be altered.
The American flag for the keyboard switcher is distorted
That's the old (KDE 4) keyboard switcher, probably shown because you had some old KDED modules from KDE 4 still installed or loaded. In pure Plasma 5 environment the layout switcher only says "us" or "cz" etc.
Allow me to add to your list....
Starting from a "Saved Session" doesn't work. The windows may be restored, but they are never in the location you've saved them. And, they all end up on a single virtual desktop. And the systray may or may not be at the height you previously specified. And, even if you save a session and you want to start with Virtual Desktop 2 displayed, you'll get Virtual Desktop
Yes, this is a big issue :(
The default window size for konsole aren't always retained between login sessions. Sometimes I get the 82x24 I want, and sometimes I don't.
I think this might be related to the above :(
I can't define the date/time format for the systray clock that I want. I want 24hr format an mm/dd/yy.
We could add the to the configuration UI, or you could try to change that in regional and datetime settings.
The "upgrade" to Plasma 5 should be "seamless" in that your themes and decorations are retained. User installed themes are in a new location but not moved in the "upgrade" process. Users will have to spend time to redo their environment. If they have many systems they may get annoyed.
In most cases that is not possible, as Oxygen Plasma 5 itself looks very differently from Oxygen in KDE 4 (+ Breeze is now the default), and most 3rd party themes and decorations don't provide Qt 5 versions yet, so what actually happens is fallback to default.
Plus there were some major changings in the internals of Plasma, so the devs decided that it will be safer to not migrate the shell configuration (basically, it's better not to migrate anything than to migrate only something and break stuff).
You can't have a different wallpaper for each Virtual Desktop. This makes life boring.
I think this is planned for 5.4 :)
There is no kwallet manager for Plasma 5 at this time....or so I've been told.
Jan is working on it, KWalletManager5 should hit repos in time for F22.
There is still the issue with kwalletmanager in dvratil-plasma-5 for f21 that I reported here:
http://permalink.gmane.org/gmane.linux.redhat.fedora.kde/14329
Will kwalletmanager5 come to that repo and obsolete kwalletmanager-5, and what about the kwalletmanager-4 vs. kwalletmanager-14 versioning mishaps there?
Michael
On Monday, May 11, 2015 12:05:40 PM Michael J Gruber wrote:
Daniel Vrátil venit, vidit, dixit 11.05.2015 11:37:
Hi,
let me try to address some of the issues you and Eli raised here
On Monday, May 11, 2015 04:59:38 PM Ed Greshko wrote:
On 05/11/15 16:15, Eli Wapniarski wrote:
Please everyone... I am not trolling or trying to start a debate. I am just stating my own very personal views with the following.
I will start and end with the same statement.
My comments here in no way reflects the exceptionally good work and repsonsiveness of Fedora's KDE Team.
This is the first time that I can remember that I am not looking forward to the next release of Fedora.
I have done a bit of fiddeling with plasma 5 and I must say as a long time KDE user I will not be upgrading to Plasma 5 on my main office or home systems given its current state. It is buggy, missing many features that I have become accustommed to and I have no way to work around the issues.
Totally agree and I've pretty much, I think, stated the same in an earlier email.
While the individual issues that I have discovered may be minor, add them all up together with all the problems and issues that have been posted recently means some obstruction to my work flow.
I will list the problems:
no screensaver
clock on the system tray takes up way to much realestate
Digital or analog clock? With date or without? I use digital clock with date and it really only takes the minimum necessary space.
resizing windows causes my windows to black until I click the app on the task switcher to minimze and then restore
Hmm, could be a driver issue? Have you tried with KWin effects disabled (Alt +Shift+F12)?
I cannot set my regional settings to the country where I live without changing the language of interface I want it to remain english.
Is System Settings -> Regional Settings -> Formats what you are looking for? This does only affect time, currency etc. format, but not the actual language of the UI.
kdepim has not been ported to the new library set yet.
I don't see how this is a problem :-) We are going to release Qt5/KF5-based KDE PIM in August with KDE Applications 15.08 and our aim is for users not to be able to tell any difference between KDE 4 and KF5 version.
The text contrast kicker cannot be altered.
The American flag for the keyboard switcher is distorted
That's the old (KDE 4) keyboard switcher, probably shown because you had some old KDED modules from KDE 4 still installed or loaded. In pure Plasma 5 environment the layout switcher only says "us" or "cz" etc.
Allow me to add to your list....
Starting from a "Saved Session" doesn't work. The windows may be restored, but they are never in the location you've saved them. And, they all end up on a single virtual desktop. And the systray may or may not be at the height you previously specified. And, even if you save a session and you want to start with Virtual Desktop 2 displayed, you'll get Virtual Desktop
Yes, this is a big issue :(
The default window size for konsole aren't always retained between login sessions. Sometimes I get the 82x24 I want, and sometimes I don't.
I think this might be related to the above :(
I can't define the date/time format for the systray clock that I want. I want 24hr format an mm/dd/yy.
We could add the to the configuration UI, or you could try to change that in regional and datetime settings.
The "upgrade" to Plasma 5 should be "seamless" in that your themes and decorations are retained. User installed themes are in a new location but not moved in the "upgrade" process. Users will have to spend time to redo their environment. If they have many systems they may get annoyed.
In most cases that is not possible, as Oxygen Plasma 5 itself looks very differently from Oxygen in KDE 4 (+ Breeze is now the default), and most 3rd party themes and decorations don't provide Qt 5 versions yet, so what actually happens is fallback to default.
Plus there were some major changings in the internals of Plasma, so the devs decided that it will be safer to not migrate the shell configuration (basically, it's better not to migrate anything than to migrate only something and break stuff).
You can't have a different wallpaper for each Virtual Desktop. This makes life boring.
I think this is planned for 5.4 :)
There is no kwallet manager for Plasma 5 at this time....or so I've been told.
Jan is working on it, KWalletManager5 should hit repos in time for F22.
There is still the issue with kwalletmanager in dvratil-plasma-5 for f21 that I reported here:
http://permalink.gmane.org/gmane.linux.redhat.fedora.kde/14329
Will kwalletmanager5 come to that repo and obsolete kwalletmanager-5, and what about the kwalletmanager-4 vs. kwalletmanager-14 versioning mishaps there?
Thanks for reminder, I'll adjust the Copr packaging and include kwalletmanager5 in the Copr as well.
Dan
Michael
kde mailing list kde@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/kde New to KDE4? - get help from http://userbase.kde.org
Daniel Vrátil venit, vidit, dixit 11.05.2015 13:00:
There is still the issue with kwalletmanager in dvratil-plasma-5 for f21 that I reported here:
http://permalink.gmane.org/gmane.linux.redhat.fedora.kde/14329
Will kwalletmanager5 come to that repo and obsolete kwalletmanager-5, and what about the kwalletmanager-4 vs. kwalletmanager-14 versioning mishaps there?
Thanks for reminder, I'll adjust the Copr packaging and include kwalletmanager5 in the Copr as well.
Now I see:
Installed Packages kwalletmanager.x86_64 5.0.92-3.20141107git9ef0d8c.fc21 @dvratil-plasma-5 Available Packages kwalletmanager.x86_64 4.14.3-1.fc21 fedora kwalletmanager.x86_64 5.0.92-3.20141107git9ef0d8c.fc21 @dvratil-plasma-5 kwalletmanager.x86_64 14.12.3-1.fc21 update kwalletmanager-debuginfo.x86_64 5.0.92-3.20141107git9ef0d8c.fc21 dvratil-plasma-5 kwalletmanager5.x86_64 15.04.0-1.20150501git.fc21 dvratil-plasma-5 kwalletmanager5-debuginfo.x86_64 15.04.0-1.20150501git.fc21 dvratil-plasma-5
and the packet descriptions don't quite help.
kwalletmanager-14.12.3-1.fc21 is offered as an update. I guess that would bring back the kde4 version, and I'd have to install kwm5 to have the current kwm version for kde5?
Michael
On Wednesday, May 20, 2015 11:14:24 AM Michael J Gruber wrote:
Daniel Vrátil venit, vidit, dixit 11.05.2015 13:00:
There is still the issue with kwalletmanager in dvratil-plasma-5 for f21 that I reported here:
http://permalink.gmane.org/gmane.linux.redhat.fedora.kde/14329
Will kwalletmanager5 come to that repo and obsolete kwalletmanager-5, and what about the kwalletmanager-4 vs. kwalletmanager-14 versioning mishaps there?
Thanks for reminder, I'll adjust the Copr packaging and include kwalletmanager5 in the Copr as well.
Now I see:
Installed Packages kwalletmanager.x86_64 5.0.92-3.20141107git9ef0d8c.fc21 @dvratil-plasma-5 Available Packages kwalletmanager.x86_64 4.14.3-1.fc21 fedora kwalletmanager.x86_64 5.0.92-3.20141107git9ef0d8c.fc21 @dvratil-plasma-5 kwalletmanager.x86_64 14.12.3-1.fc21 update kwalletmanager-debuginfo.x86_64 5.0.92-3.20141107git9ef0d8c.fc21 dvratil-plasma-5 kwalletmanager5.x86_64 15.04.0-1.20150501git.fc21 dvratil-plasma-5 kwalletmanager5-debuginfo.x86_64 15.04.0-1.20150501git.fc21 dvratil-
plasma-5
and the packet descriptions don't quite help.
kwalletmanager-14.12.3-1.fc21 is offered as an update. I guess that would bring back the kde4 version, and I'd have to install kwm5 to have the current kwm version for kde5?
Yes. you should be able to install both at the same time to get access to both KDE4 and KF5 KWallet. This is an unfortunate situation, but it's only transitional until all applications are migrated to the KF5 KWallet by upstream.
Cheers, Daniel
Michael
kde mailing list kde@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/kde New to KDE4? - get help from http://userbase.kde.org
Daniel Vrátil composed on 2015-05-11 11:37 (UTC+0200):
clock on the system tray takes up way to much realestate
Digital or analog clock? With date or without? I use digital clock with date and it really only takes the minimum necessary space.
...
You say "minimum". Others might disagree:
Half clock: ##:##:## AM or ##:## PM
Full clock: ##:##:## or ##:##
The difference with seconds is approximately 37.5% extra width required for the half clock, 11 characters vs. 8. Without seconds, it's 8 vs. 5, 60% extra for the half clock.
I can't define the date/time format for the systray clock that I want. I want 24hr format an mm/dd/yy.
We could add the to the configuration UI, or you could try to change that in regional and datetime settings.
...
Same here.... And I hope someone does actually listen. :-) :-)
I know this is an old cliche, but upstream is always willing to listen, so reporting those issues directly to upstream gives you higher chance of seeing those issues resolved.
https://bugs.kde.org/show_bug.cgi?id=340982 "I cannot set my short date to YYYY-MM-DD, nor my time to HH:MM"
It doesn't appear upstream is hearing this as anything serious, and blaming upstream QT for delay in doing anything about it. Difficulty (inability?) to locate and apply ISO 8601 formats is a gross and inexcusable omission/regression, regardless of reason why or difficulty fixing.
On 05/11/2015 05:17 AM, Felix Miata wrote:
Daniel Vrátil composed on 2015-05-11 11:37 (UTC+0200):
clock on the system tray takes up way to much realestate
Digital or analog clock? With date or without? I use digital clock with date and it really only takes the minimum necessary space.
...
You say "minimum". Others might disagree:
Half clock: ##:##:## AM or ##:## PM
Full clock: ##:##:## or ##:##
The difference with seconds is approximately 37.5% extra width required for the half clock, 11 characters vs. 8. Without seconds, it's 8 vs. 5, 60% extra for the half clock.
Digital clock. The problem this causes for me is that if I add the short date display, the clock becomes too small unless I make the panel much taller than I would like. Without AM/PM, I don't think this would be a problem... but of course I can't have US English with ISO 8601.
On 05/11/2015 09:12 AM, Glenn Holmer wrote: <<>>
Digital clock. The problem this causes for me is that if I add the short date display, the clock becomes too small unless I make the panel much taller than I would like. Without AM/PM, I don't think this would be a problem...
instead of having panel horizontal, consider vertical along right side of desktop.
i am now using kde 4 with panel to right side.
on a monitor with a 25.0mm tall screen and 7.0mm wide panel, i am able to show in top down order;
kickoff launcher, device notifier, desktop panels, 30 applications, system tray, clock as hh:mm:ss, date as 'wd, dd mm yyyy'
with 30 applications minimized, window names are easy to read. i can open an additional 20 to 30 windows and still read names. tho i do not believe i will ever have need for such.
as for iso 8601, format is 'vulgar', when time/date is clicked to show calendar, 'first week' is shown in calendar.
hth.
On Tue, May 12, 2015 at 01:20:59AM -0500, g wrote:
On 05/11/2015 09:12 AM, Glenn Holmer wrote: <<>>
Digital clock. The problem this causes for me is that if I add the short date display, the clock becomes too small unless I make the panel much taller than I would like. Without AM/PM, I don't think this would be a problem...
instead of having panel horizontal, consider vertical along right side of desktop.
would love to have that as most monitors are insanely wide but so far in every release tested I had to resort to horizontal auto-hiding panels. There was always something that did not display/work acceptably in vertical panels.
Richard
--- Name and OpenPGP keys available from pgp key servers
On 05/11/2015 04:37 AM, Daniel Vrátil wrote:
I cannot set my regional settings to the country where I live without changing the language of interface I want it to remain english.
Is System Settings -> Regional Settings -> Formats what you are looking for? This does only affect time, currency etc. format, but not the actual language of the UI.
I want US English with yyyy-mm-dd and 24-hour time (ISO 8601). Please show me how I can do that.
On 05/11/2015 02:15 AM, Eli Wapniarski wrote:
Please everyone... I am not trolling or trying to start a debate. I am just stating my own very personal views with the following.
I will start and end with the same statement.
My comments here in no way reflects the exceptionally good work and repsonsiveness of Fedora's KDE Team.
This is the first time that I can remember that I am not looking forward to the next release of Fedora.
Hmm, how long have you been around :). I think this will be another skipped release for my organization, as we did when KDE4 came out. However, it will be good to get plasma 5 out there and tested and fixed so that when F23 comes out hopefully it will be usable. Meanwhile I think we'll happily stay on F21.
On Mon, May 11, 2015 at 9:46 AM, Orion Poplawski orion@cora.nwra.com wrote:
However, it will be good to get plasma 5 out there and tested and fixed so that when F23 comes out hopefully it will be usable. Meanwhile I think we'll happily stay on F21.
Yes, agreed... at some point you have to take the leap and go to production in order to iron out remaining issues. Testing can only take you so far, and people all test different things. Each time you open up to a larger group of people new issues arise. I think this group is an extremely valuable resource. If issues aren't reported, they cannot be addressed.
One thing to keep in mind, when you can verify something is an issue, open a bug report and search upstream to see if it has been reported there. If not, open an issue upstream and reference that back to the bugzilla ticket. This helps track issues.
I believe this all makes a difference. People may get defensive, and at times the banter gets a bit snarky; but all participating share the common goal of making Fedora a better product for everyone.
On Monday 11 May 2015 11:00:30 Gerald B. Cox wrote:
On Mon, May 11, 2015 at 9:46 AM, Orion Poplawski orion@cora.nwra.com
wrote:
However, it will be good to get plasma 5 out there and tested and fixed so that when F23 comes out hopefully it will be usable. Meanwhile I think we'll happily stay on F21.
Yes, agreed... at some point you have to take the leap and go to production in order to iron out remaining issues. Testing can only take you so far, and people all test different things. Each time you open up to a larger group of people new issues arise. I think this group is an extremely valuable resource. If issues aren't reported, they cannot be addressed.
One thing to keep in mind, when you can verify something is an issue, open a bug report and search upstream to see if it has been reported there. If not, open an issue upstream and reference that back to the bugzilla ticket. This helps track issues.
I believe this all makes a difference. People may get defensive, and at times the banter gets a bit snarky; but all participating share the common goal of making Fedora a better product for everyone.
Agreed.... I will try to get my stuff reported asap and over the next couple of days. Work may get a bit hectic so....
Eli Wapniarski wrote:
This is the first time that I can remember that I am not looking forward to the next release of Fedora.
I guess this is because this time you're actually trying the new major version early. :-)
Last time you were indeed looking forward to Fedora 9 and KDE 4: http://kde-redhat-users.narkive.com/smrspSIm/kde-4-what-s-the-game-plan … but then… http://kde-redhat-users.narkive.com/6klxIMWo/criticism-of-f9-fairness
Trying the new version before upgrading to it is a good thing, and there's nothing preventing you from skipping a release. That's why Fedora n only reaches its end of life (EOL) after the Fedora n+2 release.
Kevin Kofler
On Wednesday 27 May 2015 03:59:34 Kevin Kofler wrote:
Eli Wapniarski wrote:
This is the first time that I can remember that I am not looking forward to the next release of Fedora.
I guess this is because this time you're actually trying the new major version early. :-)
Last time you were indeed looking forward to Fedora 9 and KDE 4: http://kde-redhat-users.narkive.com/smrspSIm/kde-4-what-s-the-game-plan … but then… http://kde-redhat-users.narkive.com/6klxIMWo/criticism-of-f9-fairness
Trying the new version before upgrading to it is a good thing, and there's nothing preventing you from skipping a release. That's why Fedora n only reaches its end of life (EOL) after the Fedora n+2 release.
Yeah...I know, but it will break my habit of doing and auto upgrade almost immedietely. My big concern with this is that I was always very confident that doing a upgrade between versions would work. Because things change so very rapidly in the Fedora world I would be worried about an on the spot upgrade even between Fedora 21 to 22 in 6 months time let alone 21 to 23.
As a suggestion only because I know that resources are limited and really I am not trying to be a wiseguy. But if it was possible, maybe you guys should think of a plan to get a "Longer Term" release with something like a year or 2 year release cycle for each version with the same current EOL policy of Fedora / KDE and "Bleeding Edge" but "stable" release with the current release schedule.
I know that this is asking a lot... its just an idea. :)
Kevin Kofler
kde mailing list kde@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/kde New to KDE4? - get help from http://userbase.kde.org
Germano Massullo wrote:
I have a question: is it safe to upgrade from F20 directly to F22?
Yes, that should work. Upgrading directly from Fedora n to Fedora n+2 is supported. (Fedora n to Fedora n+3 is not, mainly because Fedora n reaches its end of life months before the Fedora n+3 release.) But of course it is not tested as much as from Fedora n to Fedora n+1 (but one test of upgrading from Fedora n-2 is part of the Fedora n release validation criteria).
Kevin Kofler
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Eli Wapniarski -
Felix Miata -
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Glenn Holmer -
Kevin Kofler -
Michael J Gruber -
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