Summary/Minutes from today's Fedora infrastructure meeting (2012-04-19) (new time)
by Kevin Fenzi
============================================
#fedora-meeting: Infrastructure (2012-04-19)
============================================
Meeting started by nirik at 18:00:00 UTC. The full logs are available at
http://meetbot.fedoraproject.org/fedora-meeting/2012-04-19/infrastructure...
.
Meeting summary
---------------
* Robot Roll Call (nirik, 18:00:01)
* New folks introductions and Apprentice tasks. (nirik, 18:02:13)
* two factor auth status (nirik, 18:04:02)
* Staging re-work status (nirik, 18:04:29)
* Applications status / discussion (nirik, 18:06:38)
* reviews needed to move fedmsg ahead. (nirik, 18:10:09)
* ACTION: threebean to post list (nirik, 18:10:20)
* LINK: http://gitorious.org/sticky-notes (nirik, 18:12:46)
* looking at sticky-notes for a pastebin server (nirik, 18:14:03)
* Meeting time (nirik, 18:17:44)
* Upcoming Tasks/Items (nirik, 18:19:34)
* 2012-05-01 to 2012-05-15 - F17 Final Freeze. (nirik, 18:19:43)
* 2012-05-01 - nag fi-apprentices. (nirik, 18:19:43)
* 2011-05-03 - gitweb-cache removal day. (nirik, 18:19:43)
* 2012-05-09 - Check if puppet works on f17 yet. (nirik, 18:19:43)
* 2012-05-10 - drop inactive fi-apprentices (nirik, 18:19:43)
* 2012-05-15 - F17 release (nirik, 18:19:44)
* Private Cloud (nirik, 18:22:06)
* waiting for hardware, will move forward once thats done. (nirik,
18:27:23)
* Open floor (nirik, 18:29:28)
* LINK: http://fedorahosted.org/koji and
http://koji.fedoraproject.org/koji/ (nirik, 18:35:40)
* need a solution to find builds that need lots of memory. (nirik,
18:41:12)
* IDEA: ask koji developers upstream for a solution (nirik, 18:41:22)
* ACTION: dgilmore to talk to mikes about koji options. (nirik,
18:48:22)
* LINK: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Fails_to_build_from_source
(nirik, 18:53:06)
* will setup initial ansible ssh keys for testing with. (nirik,
19:01:06)
* LINK: http://images.srv1.elrod.me/stickynotes-fedora.png
(CodeBlock, 19:02:33)
* provide feedback on sticky-notes theme:
http://images.srv1.elrod.me/stickynotes-fedora.png (nirik,
19:04:00)
Meeting ended at 19:06:02 UTC.
Action Items
------------
* threebean to post list
* dgilmore to talk to mikes about koji options.
Action Items, by person
-----------------------
* dgilmore
* dgilmore to talk to mikes about koji options.
* threebean
* threebean to post list
* **UNASSIGNED**
* (none)
People Present (lines said)
---------------------------
* nirik (145)
* skvidal (75)
* dgilmore (35)
* herlo (32)
* codemaniac (11)
* misc (9)
* ctria (7)
* CodeBlock (7)
* abadger1999 (5)
* zodbot (4)
* threebean (4)
* ianweller (3)
* pingou (3)
* mmello (3)
* lmacken (2)
* athmane (1)
* smooge (0)
* ricky (0)
* mdomsch (0)
--
18:00:00 <nirik> #startmeeting Infrastructure (2012-04-19)
18:00:00 <zodbot> Meeting started Thu Apr 19 18:00:00 2012 UTC. The chair is nirik. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
18:00:00 <zodbot> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #halp #info #idea #link #topic.
18:00:01 <nirik> #meetingname infrastructure
18:00:01 <zodbot> The meeting name has been set to 'infrastructure'
18:00:01 <nirik> #topic Robot Roll Call
18:00:01 <nirik> #chair smooge skvidal CodeBlock ricky nirik abadger1999 lmacken dgilmore mdomsch threebean
18:00:01 <zodbot> Current chairs: CodeBlock abadger1999 dgilmore lmacken mdomsch nirik ricky skvidal smooge threebean
18:00:11 <nirik> who all is around for a infrastructure meeting?
18:00:15 * lmacken
18:00:19 * skvidal is here
18:00:23 * threebean is here
18:00:27 * athmane is here
18:00:31 * ianweller is last-minuting a physics lab report but will pay attention
18:01:18 * pingou
18:01:24 <dgilmore> buenos
18:02:06 <nirik> ok, lets go ahead and dive in.
18:02:13 <nirik> #topic New folks introductions and Apprentice tasks.
18:02:14 <nirik> If any new folks want to give a quick one line bio or any apprentices
18:02:14 <nirik> would like to ask general questions, they can do so here.
18:02:32 <nirik> any new folks? or questions on easyfix tickets or general getting started questions?
18:03:54 <nirik> ok, moving on then...
18:04:02 <nirik> #topic two factor auth status
18:04:03 <skvidal> no changes on 2fa - pto the beginning of this week.
18:04:18 <nirik> ok. We can ping it next week...
18:04:29 <nirik> #topic Staging re-work status
18:04:34 <nirik> I've worked on this some.
18:04:40 <nirik> I've commited docs on the new setup.
18:04:56 <nirik> please read http://infrastructure.fedoraproject.org/infra/docs/staging.txt and let me know if anything needs fixing.
18:05:18 <nirik> I'm going to try and get the bapp01->02 move done, and easyfix moved to production, then we can do the staging branch killing. ;)
18:05:53 <nirik> any questions on that ?
18:06:35 <nirik> ok, I'll schedule the actual staging killing after those other 2 things are done.
18:06:38 <nirik> #topic Applications status / discussion
18:06:44 <nirik> any news on applications this week?
18:07:08 <nirik> abadger1999 / threebean / lmacken / pingou / CodeBlock / anyone else who works on apps. ;)
18:07:33 <abadger1999> New python-fedora this week that should resolve some issues clients were seeing.
18:07:45 <nirik> yeah, thanks for that fix.
18:07:54 <lmacken> abadger1999++
18:08:12 * nirik still doesn't fully understand it, but thats ok
18:08:16 <abadger1999> I'm not aware of any of our scripts that were running into this but it won't hurt them to update on the infra boxes.
18:08:58 <threebean> fedmsg progress - got a mediawiki plugin done and tested locally. waiting still on lots of package reviews.
18:09:13 <ianweller> he's alive!
18:09:44 <nirik> threebean: could you perhaps drop a list to the infra list? or a wiki page link or something? then we can try and divide them up...
18:09:54 <threebean> sure thing
18:10:08 * threebean writes that now
18:10:09 <nirik> #info reviews needed to move fedmsg ahead.
18:10:20 <nirik> #action threebean to post list
18:11:08 <nirik> ok, any other app news?
18:11:22 <dgilmore> where did we ever get with re-writing fpaste?
18:12:15 <nirik> dgilmore: oh yeah, have some news on that...
18:12:32 <nirik> we are looking at possibly using sticky-notes instead for the server side.
18:12:46 <nirik> http://gitorious.org/sticky-notes
18:12:47 <abadger1999> mmello, I believe was interested in helping out with reviews, too.
18:13:01 <nirik> it's under review, pending some fixes from upstream.
18:13:13 <nirik> athmane has found some issues and submitted patches to it.
18:13:24 <mmello> abadger1999: yes..I'm
18:13:32 <dgilmore> nirik: cool
18:13:44 <dgilmore> mmello: get to work ;)
18:13:50 <mmello> abadger1999: threebean is helping to understand the process and I'm currently review my first package
18:13:53 <mmello> dgilmore: :)
18:14:03 <nirik> #info looking at sticky-notes for a pastebin server
18:14:11 <dgilmore> nirik: would the current fpaste client work with the new server? or need rewritten?
18:14:18 <nirik> there's a command line 'pastebinit' already in fedora.
18:14:25 <dgilmore> cool
18:14:35 <nirik> so, we could look at making it obsolete fpaste and perhaps provide a compat link.
18:14:50 <nirik> it misses a few things like the --sysinfo tho.
18:15:18 <nirik> anyhow, it looks promising.
18:15:34 <codemaniac> hello nirik and everyone
18:15:44 <nirik> morning codemaniac. welcome.
18:16:01 <codemaniac> good morning to you too nirik
18:16:03 <dgilmore> nirik: :) figured id ask
18:16:09 <pingou> but php
18:16:15 <ctria> hi all. did i get lost timezones again?
18:16:17 <nirik> pingou: yeah, its php.
18:16:27 <nirik> ctria: meeting just started 15m ago. ;)
18:16:35 <nirik> any further news on applications?
18:16:35 <ctria> :(
18:16:49 <codemaniac> sorry for joining late team
18:16:56 <nirik> no problem at all.
18:17:24 <codemaniac> CodeBlock: you around ?
18:17:39 <nirik> ok, will move along then...
18:17:44 <nirik> #topic Meeting time
18:17:54 <nirik> is everyone ok with this meeting time? 18UTC?
18:17:59 <skvidal> +1
18:18:00 <pingou> +1
18:18:03 <ianweller> +1
18:18:07 <abadger1999> +1
18:18:25 <nirik> ok then... seems popular.
18:18:47 <codemaniac> yea niriki , i am very much comfortable with this time , its +5:30 UTC here
18:19:07 <codemaniac> +1024
18:19:13 <nirik> cool.
18:19:34 <nirik> #topic Upcoming Tasks/Items
18:19:43 <nirik> #info 2012-05-01 to 2012-05-15 - F17 Final Freeze.
18:19:43 <nirik> #info 2012-05-01 - nag fi-apprentices.
18:19:43 <nirik> #info 2011-05-03 - gitweb-cache removal day.
18:19:43 <nirik> #info 2012-05-09 - Check if puppet works on f17 yet.
18:19:43 <nirik> #info 2012-05-10 - drop inactive fi-apprentices
18:19:44 <nirik> #info 2012-05-15 - F17 release
18:19:53 <nirik> so final freeze is coming up.
18:20:25 <nirik> One thing I will probibly schedule soon is a migration of our hosted machine... hosted03 -> hosted01/02. Should be a pretty easy migration.
18:20:37 <nirik> anyone have other items they are working on they would like to schedule or shout out?
18:21:46 <nirik> ok, I'll take that as a no. ;)
18:21:55 <dgilmore> nothing here
18:22:06 <nirik> #topic Private Cloud
18:22:14 <nirik> just a short mention of our cloud plans....
18:22:14 <skvidal> we have new progress?
18:22:35 <nirik> not really... but I made a wiki page: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Infrastructure_private_cloud
18:22:58 <nirik> so, if people have suggestions/ideas, post them on list.
18:23:01 * skvidal counts backward from 5
18:23:16 <nirik> we are currently waiting for hardware still, but I think we have close to the config we want speced out.
18:23:32 <codemaniac> nirik: you have already finalized the budget and initial designs right , t
18:24:02 <codemaniac> what exactly the cloud is going to host ?
18:24:05 <nirik> codemaniac: yeah, for the initial part of it. We can hopefully expand it next year if it works out. ;)
18:24:11 <skvidal> codemaniac: read the page - it explains
18:24:12 <nirik> see the wiki page...
18:24:52 <nirik> so, I think it will be very handy once we have it in place.
18:24:56 <ctria> just curiosity, can't we have any cloud solution from red hat or this is what red hat proposes?
18:25:13 <nirik> as we get closer to deploying it, we will no doubt want lots of people to help test it and such.
18:25:22 <herlo> nirik: who's doing the work? I'd love to help. I should have some time in the next couple of weeks to ramp up
18:25:31 <nirik> ctria: we evaluated a number of cloud tech, and found eucalyptus to meet our needs.
18:25:52 <nirik> herlo: skvidal is point on it... we are kinda holding on hardware tho.
18:25:59 <skvidal> hi
18:26:13 <herlo> nirik: skvidal: okay, just ping me when you are ready
18:26:14 <skvidal> we have a test cluster running. it doesn't do a lot b/c of the lack of ips to use w/it
18:26:27 <herlo> nod
18:26:44 <nirik> yeah. hard to use when you can't get to it from outside easily.
18:26:51 <codemaniac> me too in , would like to offer whatever i can
18:27:23 <nirik> #info waiting for hardware, will move forward once thats done.
18:27:24 <herlo> what will it take to get more IPs? Or do we need to free some up elsewhere?
18:27:53 <nirik> the new hardware will have a pile of external ips for us to use.
18:28:01 <herlo> okay, great
18:28:14 * herlo is done asking questions now
18:29:25 <nirik> cool...
18:29:28 <nirik> #topic Open floor
18:29:42 <nirik> anyone have items for open floor? general questions? etc
18:29:59 <skvidal> global updates
18:30:14 <skvidal> should I go ahead and just shoot a yum update on most everything?
18:30:59 <nirik> yeah, I think so.
18:31:02 <abadger1999> +1
18:31:08 <nirik> catch back up after the freeze.
18:31:10 <skvidal> ok
18:31:37 <nirik> I don't think we need reboots tho. The last update kernel fixes several security issues, but not sure how much they apply to our setup
18:32:04 <skvidal> second thing
18:32:12 <skvidal> builders and koji
18:32:25 <skvidal> I'd like to take buildvm01 and 02 out of koji for a while
18:32:31 <dgilmore> skvidal: ok
18:32:31 <skvidal> so I can mess with them
18:32:44 <nirik> sounds fine to me. Not much build activity right now anyhow.
18:32:56 <skvidal> and I'd like to find out about more migration to having more builders be vm-based
18:33:32 <nirik> what were the next steps in that plan?
18:33:53 <skvidal> 1. we need a way of telling koji that some pkgs need A LOT of ram
18:34:13 <skvidal> 2. we need to convert more of the x86-## boxes to buildvmhost
18:34:33 <dgilmore> skvidal: we have no way today of knowing that
18:34:50 <codemaniac> A lame question , what is koji ?
18:34:52 <nirik> dgilmore: won't we need that for arm anyhow? and seed with their list?
18:34:58 <misc> codemaniac: the build hub
18:35:00 <nirik> codemaniac: not lame at all. ;) Our buildsystem...
18:35:11 <dgilmore> skvidal: for arm we have a seperate channel called heavybuilder, and it has a list of packages in the koji hub policy that it sends to that channel
18:35:13 <ctria> is there a list of packages to blame for LOT ram?
18:35:16 <dgilmore> but its not an automatic thing
18:35:23 <dgilmore> its a manually maintained list
18:35:25 <skvidal> dgilmore: oh - so we can't do that?
18:35:28 <skvidal> ctria: more or less
18:35:40 <nirik> http://fedorahosted.org/koji and http://koji.fedoraproject.org/koji/
18:35:41 <ctria> then we could probably create a new channel and redirect them there
18:35:44 <misc> codemaniac: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Using_the_Koji_build_system should answer the questions do not hesitate to ask for clarification
18:35:48 <dgilmore> skvidal: we can but its prone to failure and will need constant tweaking
18:35:56 <ctria> in the new channel to have better specs for builders
18:36:07 <skvidal> dgilmore: having all of our hosts have 8GB+ ram seems.... like poor resource use
18:36:13 <nirik> dgilmore: does changing that need a hub restart?
18:36:16 <codemaniac> thanks misc, nirik .Sure i will ask
18:36:20 <dgilmore> nirik: it does
18:36:20 <skvidal> dgilmore: since 95% of our pkgs don't need even 2GB of ram
18:36:25 <nirik> thats a pain.
18:36:25 <dgilmore> skvidal: right
18:36:39 <herlo> skvidal: +1 to not using a hammer for all builders
18:36:41 <skvidal> I suspect the largermem pkgs are probably under 50
18:36:46 <nirik> wonder if we could ask upstream koji for a better fix... some on the fly thing.
18:37:06 <misc> and I think the list would not grow much over time
18:37:19 <dgilmore> nirik: well we could probably write the policy so that if the task load is above say 4 where 6 is the max it goes to a bigger builder
18:37:28 <herlo> I've run into similar issues, I think it's possible to have a koji setting for ram requirements.
18:37:43 <dgilmore> nirik: but there could be something under a load of 4 that uses lots of ram to say link
18:37:53 <nirik> yeah.
18:37:59 <dgilmore> the last load is dynamically worked out based on avaergae build completion time
18:38:05 <dgilmore> the lask load
18:38:10 <dgilmore> task
18:38:11 <herlo> lol
18:38:14 <misc> couldn't cgroup be used to track the ram used by a set of process ?
18:38:25 <dgilmore> misc: builders are all rhel6
18:38:53 <nirik> so, I guess we all ponder on the problem and try and come up with a good solution...
18:39:02 <skvidal> nirik: I think your suggestion is a good place to start
18:39:07 <skvidal> ask koji upstream for help
18:39:24 <misc> ok so can we track the memory on vm ?
18:39:25 <nirik> it would be nice to have a better solution for arm too...
18:39:33 <misc> I think that's how balooning does, no ?
18:39:36 <dgilmore> nirik: probably the best solution would be to have koji keep track of ram usage during builds and store that. then we could do things nicely
18:39:43 <dgilmore> but thats likely alot of work
18:39:43 <nirik> misc: the problem is that we get a package to build and we don't know how much mem it will need to build.
18:39:45 <skvidal> misc: you mean on the fly allocation of ram?
18:39:52 <misc> ( or maybe polling memory in the vm every minutes, to have some stats )
18:39:53 <herlo> +1 nirik's suggestion
18:40:00 <skvidal> misc: normally the event which tells us it is out of memory is that it OOMs
18:40:01 <nirik> dgilmore: hum... yeah.
18:40:26 <dgilmore> we can somewhat safely make assumptions based on previous builds
18:40:30 <nirik> or perhaps a FTBFS run could also tell us which packages need more mem and we set the list based on that?
18:40:46 <nirik> at least it would be a good seed.
18:41:07 <dgilmore> i suspect that having a task load of more than 4 would cover 95% of cases
18:41:11 <dgilmore> maybe 100%
18:41:12 <nirik> #info need a solution to find builds that need lots of memory.
18:41:13 <ctria> there is definition for package name in koji policies http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Koji/Policies
18:41:22 <nirik> #idea ask koji developers upstream for a solution
18:41:44 <skvidal> nirik: hmm
18:42:04 <skvidal> nirik: so here's an idea of what i could do on buildvm##
18:42:14 <skvidal> it would take a while, though...
18:42:30 <skvidal> iteratively build every pkg on the 4gb they have available
18:42:37 <skvidal> and see which ones cause it to oom
18:42:53 <nirik> that would take quite a long while...
18:42:56 <dgilmore> channel = method createrepo :: use createrepo has req_channel :: req is_child_task :: parent source */gcc* :: use heavybuilder source */glibc* :: use heavybuilder source */kernel* :: use heavybuilder
18:42:58 <skvidal> I know :)
18:43:07 <skvidal> dgilmore: -ENOCONTEXT
18:43:09 <dgilmore> thats a snippet of the policy use on arm
18:43:28 <nirik> once we have the cloud setup, we could fire up N builders with 4GB and mass rebuild... :)
18:43:28 <dgilmore> it came aross bas
18:43:44 <skvidal> nirik: so...
18:43:49 <nirik> ceph is apparently another one.
18:43:58 <nirik> webkitgtk is also a pig ;)
18:44:01 <skvidal> nirik: I could convert an existing x86-## box
18:44:05 <skvidal> nirik: to buildvmhost
18:44:06 <dgilmore> skvidal: http://fpaste.org/QfFj/ thats the full current policy used on arm
18:44:16 <skvidal> nirik: and then i'd have 8+ builders to test with
18:45:00 <nirik> yeah, still will take a while, but less while. ;)
18:45:53 <skvidal> I'm open to other options...
18:45:56 <skvidal> considering our build load
18:46:03 <skvidal> I could probably rob 2 more machines w/o us losing out muchj
18:46:24 <nirik> I'm fine with that, but perhaps we should see if koji dev's have any brilliant ideas we are missing first?
18:46:24 <dgilmore> skvidal: sure. we really only hit the builders really hard for mass rebuilds
18:46:25 <skvidal> our peak afaict has been like 23% use
18:46:36 <skvidal> nirik: you're no fun at all ! :)
18:46:46 <nirik> I know, right? :)
18:46:52 <skvidal> nirik: I can bounce an email to buildsys list
18:46:58 <misc> dgilmore: technically, that's some form of mass rebuild, so maybe this can be done at the same time
18:47:20 <misc> ( or, if someone is gonna rebuild everything, this can produce a list of FBTS and a list of package that need more ram )
18:47:40 <dgilmore> nirik: ill talk with the mikes
18:48:07 <skvidal> dgilmore: even better :)
18:48:12 <nirik> works for me.
18:48:22 <nirik> #action dgilmore to talk to mikes about koji options.
18:48:39 <nirik> misc: we typically only do mass rebuilds when there's a good reason... rpm payload change, gcc change, etc.
18:48:40 <CodeBlock> agh, late, sorry
18:48:41 * CodeBlock here
18:49:08 <nirik> misc: but we hope to use the new cloud setup to mass rebuild to check the FTBFS stuff.
18:49:11 <skvidal> nirik: I think I'd like the opportunity to see if I can do a sensible port of ftbfs over to mockchain, etc
18:49:38 <nirik> yeah, would be good. keeping in mind hopefully that it would be portable to the privatecloud.
18:49:52 <skvidal> it should just be ssh-based
18:50:08 <skvidal> so the only difference is how you get the instances started
18:50:13 <skvidal> not how you spawn off jobs
18:50:26 <nirik> yeah.
18:50:45 <skvidal> question about ftbfs
18:50:55 <skvidal> does that build all rawhide srpms against rawhide?
18:51:20 <nirik> yep.
18:51:34 <nirik> we can ask mdomsch for his scripts.
18:51:55 <dgilmore> skvidal: i believe thats how mdomsch did it
18:51:58 <nirik> I think it was just basically: build everything once, get list of fails, rebuild, cycle until you have no changes.
18:52:19 <skvidal> nirik: nod
18:52:26 <skvidal> nirik: I was checking on which base it built from
18:52:30 <nirik> but there's issues with that too I guess.
18:52:32 <herlo> can someone expand ftbfs for me plz
18:52:32 <skvidal> ie: did he take a single rawhide snapshot
18:52:40 <skvidal> Fails To Build From Source
18:52:42 <nirik> herlo: fails to build from source.
18:52:45 <herlo> tx
18:52:49 <herlo> skvidal wins!
18:52:51 <nirik> ie, you get the src.rpm we have in git and it doesn't work.
18:53:06 <nirik> http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Fails_to_build_from_source
18:53:25 <herlo> yeah, I have done something very similar with my koji project
18:53:44 <nirik> rawhide can be a challenge, since there's so many moving packages. ;(
18:53:50 * dgilmore needs to run
18:54:08 <skvidal> nirik: which is why I was thinking about taking a snapshot of rawhide into a local mirror
18:54:13 <skvidal> nirik: that all the builders can see
18:54:47 <nirik> you mean for the build repo/binary rpms? or the git repos building from?
18:54:51 <nirik> or both.
18:55:25 <skvidal> build repo/binary
18:55:37 <skvidal> so that what it is building against for the build time doesn't change
18:55:54 <nirik> yeah.
18:56:04 <nirik> although if we can get it down to under a day, it would be the same rawhide. ;)
18:56:18 <skvidal> I cannot fathom how many machines we would need for that
18:56:28 <nirik> large number...
18:56:32 <skvidal> dgilmore: can I convert x86-16,17, 18 over to buildvmhosts?
18:57:20 <nirik> skvidal: I think he had to run...
18:57:27 <skvidal> okay
18:57:34 <nirik> lets continue out of meeting on this...
18:57:36 <skvidal> ok
18:57:39 <skvidal> sorryt for running on
18:57:41 <nirik> anything else for meeting?
18:57:47 <nirik> no worries at all. Good to discuss.
18:58:06 <skvidal> one more item
18:58:26 <skvidal> does anyone else have any interest in ansible and/or tryting to write playbooks?
18:58:33 * herlo does
18:58:38 <herlo> just haven't had time yet
18:58:42 <skvidal> understood.
18:58:47 <herlo> will next week or two for sure
18:58:54 <skvidal> one last thing
18:58:58 <herlo> depending on what gets done with euca, I'd be up for it
18:59:01 <nirik> yeah, I'd like to look at ansible more too.
18:59:09 <skvidal> I didn't hear any horrible screaming about the ssh key thing last week
18:59:15 <skvidal> just some minor grumbling
18:59:27 <skvidal> so.... I'm going to go ahead and make a magic key and put it on lockbox01
18:59:44 <skvidal> and start playing with it on the builder installs I've been working on
18:59:51 <nirik> fair enough.
19:00:03 <nirik> it would only be those instances for now, right? until we expand ansible use?
19:00:09 <skvidal> exactly
19:00:12 <skvidal> nothing else will have it
19:00:23 <nirik> seems sane. Shake out any issues now
19:01:06 <nirik> #info will setup initial ansible ssh keys for testing with.
19:01:19 <skvidal> okay, I'm done with all my openfloor things
19:01:20 <nirik> ok, shall we call it a meeting?
19:01:23 <nirik> :)
19:01:36 <herlo> yup
19:01:40 <herlo> call it
19:01:43 <CodeBlock> I have one quick thing
19:02:00 <nirik> CodeBlock: go for it.
19:02:33 <CodeBlock> we talked about Stickynotes as a pastebin last week, I quickly made a Fedora theme mockup (showed nirik last week, but wanted to get some more voices about it)
19:02:33 <CodeBlock> http://images.srv1.elrod.me/stickynotes-fedora.png
19:02:44 <nirik> CodeBlock: oh, codemaniac was looking to see if he could help with dpsearch. If you catch him on-line, see if he can assist any
19:03:13 <nirik> I think it's a pretty good start... might need more blue. :)
19:03:14 <CodeBlock> nirik: cool, he's been trying to ping me and our schedules have been totally missing each other
19:03:48 <herlo> CodeBlock: oh, cool
19:03:52 * herlo looks
19:04:00 <nirik> #info provide feedback on sticky-notes theme: http://images.srv1.elrod.me/stickynotes-fedora.png
19:04:03 <herlo> oh, very nice!
19:04:30 <herlo> CodeBlock: I like the theme, I bet we could package that up pretty quickly
19:04:48 <herlo> ping me when you have a package and I'll do a review
19:05:02 <herlo> we can get that into the infra repo soon I hope.
19:05:02 <nirik> herlo: it's already up. ;) dcr226 has it up and I am reviewing.
19:05:07 <CodeBlock> herlo: Cool. It needs some coding work, I just wanted to get a working prototype, but I will continue working on it
19:05:09 <herlo> nirik: with the theme?
19:05:19 <herlo> I'm specifically talking about the theme
19:05:23 <nirik> herlo: oh, sorry, no, not the theme...
19:05:27 <nirik> yeah, would be good to get that in too.
19:05:28 <herlo> :) nw
19:05:42 <nirik> ok, calling it a meeting as we are over.
19:05:45 <herlo> nirik: yeah, knew about the stickynotes review
19:05:54 <herlo> CodeBlock: awesome.
19:05:54 <nirik> Lets all continue over on #fedora-admin and #fedora-noc and #fedora-apps.
19:05:58 <herlo> indeed
19:05:58 <nirik> thanks for coming everyone!
19:06:02 <nirik> #endmeeting
12 years
FUDCon KL Meeting Minutes :: 2012-04-19
by Maverick
Hey folks,
Thanks for attending the FUDCon KL Planning Meeting (2012-04-19).
Following is the meeting summary;
Minutes:
http://meetbot.fedoraproject.org/fudcon-planning/2012-04-19/fudcon_kl_201...
Log:
http://meetbot.fedoraproject.org/fudcon-planning/2012-04-19/fudcon_kl_201...
========================
#fudcon-planning Meeting
========================
Meeting started by KageSenshi at 14:03:46 UTC. The full logs are
available at
http://meetbot.fedoraproject.org/fudcon-planning/2012-04-19/fudcon_kl_201...
.
Meeting summary
---------------
* rollcall (KageSenshi, 14:04:05)
* LINK: agenda is here :
https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/FUDCon:KualaLumpur_2012/Meeting:2012-04-19
(KageSenshi, 14:05:12)
* announcements (KageSenshi, 14:05:28)
* harish have bought all the tickets , except for those who are going
to buy themselves, and also eltermino (KageSenshi, 14:05:51)
* eltermino is still missing (KageSenshi, 14:06:05)
* banner, lanyard designs are done, but yet to get quotes to print
them (KageSenshi, 14:07:15)
* Review of actions from last meeting (KageSenshi, 14:08:42)
* LINK: last meeting logs :
https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/FUDCon:KualaLumpur_2012/Meeting:2012-04-12
(KageSenshi, 14:08:59)
* we'll be using the lanyard design for sticker (KageSenshi,
14:09:35)
* ACTION: KageSenshi to check up with harish on hotel booking status
(KageSenshi, 14:11:58)
* ACTION: KageSenshi to get formal quotes for stuff on saturday
(KageSenshi, 14:12:13)
* ACTION: KageSenshi to check up with gurdip on formal quote for bus
service (KageSenshi, 14:13:23)
* open floor (KageSenshi, 14:13:49)
* ACTION: meng will work on beverage quote this saturday (KageSenshi,
14:14:27)
Meeting ended at 14:17:27 UTC.
Action Items
------------
* KageSenshi to check up with harish on hotel booking status
* KageSenshi to get formal quotes for stuff on saturday
* KageSenshi to check up with gurdip on formal quote for bus service
* meng will work on beverage quote this saturday
Action Items, by person
-----------------------
* KageSenshi
* KageSenshi to check up with harish on hotel booking status
* KageSenshi to get formal quotes for stuff on saturday
* KageSenshi to check up with gurdip on formal quote for bus service
* meng
* meng will work on beverage quote this saturday
* **UNASSIGNED**
* (none)
People Present (lines said)
---------------------------
* KageSenshi (63)
* zodbot (9)
* Alvisyu (7)
* meng (5)
* vinz007 (4)
* yassin_ (2)
* TYSSeries (1)
* jurank_dankkal (1)
--
Kind Regards,
Maverick
MavJS @ freenode.net
https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/User:Mavjs
http://mavjs.github.com
7BFA DB9D D509 94AC 115B 1A0E E435 A5E3 A738 392D
12 years
FAmSco meeting 2012-XX-XX minutes
by Christoph Wickert
Minutes:
http://meetbot.fedoraproject.org/fedora-meeting/2012-04-18/famsco.2012-04...
Minutes (text):
http://meetbot.fedoraproject.org/fedora-meeting/2012-04-18/famsco.2012-04...
Log:
http://meetbot.fedoraproject.org/fedora-meeting/2012-04-18/famsco.2012-04...
Meet you again next week
Wednesday, April D25th
at 22:00 UTC
in #fedora-meeting!
Regards,
Christoph
==================================
#fedora-meeting: FAmSCo 2012-04-18
==================================
Meeting started by cwickert at 22:01:14 UTC. The full logs are available
at
http://meetbot.fedoraproject.org/fedora-meeting/2012-04-18/famsco.2012-04...
.
Meeting summary
---------------
* Roll call (cwickert, 22:01:32)
* y1nv sent regrets (cwickert, 22:03:50)
* LINK:
http://lists.fedoraproject.org/pipermail/famsco/2012-April/001044.html
(cwickert, 22:12:28)
* New FAmSCo election guideliens (cwickert, 22:13:59)
* New FAmSCo election guidelines (cwickert, 22:14:06)
* igor said he'd support option 3 (cwickert, 22:16:13)
* AGREED: : In order to make the transition to the new FAmSCo election
guidelines, 7 seats were up for the F17 and earlier elections, and
the F18 election will have 3 seats up for vote. The 3 seats that
will be up for election will be the bottom 3 vote-getters from the
F17 election. The 4 seats not up for election in the F18 election,
will be up for election in F19. (cwickert, 22:25:42)
* LINK: https://fedorahosted.org/famsco/report/9 (cwickert,
22:26:05)
* FUDCon bids 2012 (cwickert, 22:26:22)
* FUDCon EMEA 2012 will take place in Paris (cwickert, 22:27:51)
* Transit flight from KL to Hong Kong to start Fedora contacts with
HKLUG. (cwickert, 22:29:48)
* kaio's flight is not yet reimbursed (cwickert, 22:30:10)
* ACTION: kaio_ph to update #277 and nag harish (cwickert, 22:30:50)
* ACTION: kaio_ph to update https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/FADHK201205
(cwickert, 22:33:31)
* Funding request for Release Party F17 Surakarta (cwickert, 22:33:40)
* AGREED: approve 1.401.000 IDR and have harish reimburse it ASAP
(cwickert, 22:40:09)
* requester needs to file a new ticket for food and drinks after the
event (cwickert, 22:40:31)
* Sponsorship request for Linuxwochen Vienna and LibreGraphicsMeeting
2012 (gnokii) (cwickert, 22:42:59)
* AGREED: #285 is approved (cwickert, 22:45:07)
* Sponsorship request for Linuxwochen Vienna 2012 and LGM (2-6)
(cwickert, 22:45:27)
* AGREED: #267 is approved (cwickert, 22:51:27)
* Sponsorship request for Linuxwochen Vienna 2012 (rgeri77) (cwickert,
22:51:45)
* LINK: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Linuxwochen_Wien_2012
(gnokii, 22:54:40)
* LINK:
http://lists.fedoraproject.org/pipermail/advisory-board/2012-April/011540...
(nb, 22:57:20)
* AGREED: #283 is approved up to 100 EUR for now (cwickert, 23:02:08)
* ACTION: igorps to senad a reminder about urgent budget tickets
(cwickert, 23:09:59)
* nb's Petition for the Board to dissolve FAmSCo and call new elections
(cwickert, 23:14:21)
Meeting ended at 23:42:11 UTC.
Action Items
------------
* kaio_ph to update #277 and nag harish
* kaio_ph to update https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/FADHK201205
* igorps to senad a reminder about urgent budget tickets
Action Items, by person
-----------------------
* igorps
* igorps to senad a reminder about urgent budget tickets
* kaio_ph
* kaio_ph to update #277 and nag harish
* kaio_ph to update https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/FADHK201205
* **UNASSIGNED**
* (none)
People Present (lines said)
---------------------------
* cwickert (248)
* nb (57)
* kaio_ph (37)
* herlo (32)
* zoltanh7211 (25)
* igorps (16)
* yn1v (12)
* zodbot (10)
* gnokii (7)
* dramsey (1)
12 years
EMEA ambassadors meeting 2012-04-18 minutes
by Christoph Wickert
2 hour meeting, but very productive. A special thanks to our NA friends
for coordinating the swag orders.
Minutes:
http://meetbot.fedoraproject.org/fedora-meeting/2012-04-18/emea_ambassado...
Minutes (text):
http://meetbot.fedoraproject.org/fedora-meeting/2012-04-18/emea_ambassado...
Log:
http://meetbot.fedoraproject.org/fedora-meeting/2012-04-18/emea_ambassado...
Meet you again on
Wednesday, May 2nd (two weeks from now)
at 20:00 UTC
in #fedora-meeting!
Regards,
Christoph
============================================
#fedora-meeting: EMEA Ambassadors 2012-04-18
============================================
Meeting started by cwickert at 20:01:12 UTC. The full logs are available
at
http://meetbot.fedoraproject.org/fedora-meeting/2012-04-18/emea_ambassado...
.
Meeting summary
---------------
* Roll call (cwickert, 20:01:54)
* LINK:
https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Meeting:EMEA_Ambassadors_2012-04-18
(cwickert, 20:03:15)
* EMEA F17 media production (cwickert, 20:06:00)
* sesivany is the point of contact for the F17 media production
(cwickert, 20:06:31)
* we have requested budget from FAmSCo at
https://fedorahosted.org/famsco/ticket/280 (cwickert, 20:08:01)
* Announcements (cwickert, 20:09:03)
* FUDCon EMEA 2012 will take place in Paris from October 13th till
15th (cwickert, 20:09:50)
* Ambassadors Schedule (cwickert, 20:13:02)
* LINK:
http://rbergero.fedorapeople.org/schedules/f-17/f-17-ambassadors-tasks.html
(cwickert, 20:13:12)
* ACTION: gnokii to make a release event poster and flyer template,
color and b/w. SVG should be fine, then people can still add some
text like date, time and location (cwickert, 20:21:21)
* LINK:
http://duffy.fedorapeople.org/art/badge-stickers/sxsw-badge-stickers_draf...
(gnokii, 20:30:11)
* ambassadors want a new sticker sheet. similar to
http://nicubunu.blogspot.com/2009/05/fedora-stickers-kit-v2.html but
according to the latest logo usage guidelines (cwickert, 20:31:21)
* LINK: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Marketing/Stickers
(thunderbirdtr, 20:31:52)
* thunderbirdtr, sesivany and ib54003 are willing to assist in the
swag inventory project (cwickert, 20:39:44)
* F17 media production (continued) (cwickert, 20:40:47)
* AGREED: : EMEA ambassadors will order 6000 media, 4000 live and 200
installer. 1000 will directly go to RH (cwickert, 20:56:52)
* Events (cwickert, 20:57:35)
* LinuxTag 2012 will take place May 23rd - 26th in Berlin, see
https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/LinuxTag_2012 (cwickert, 20:58:34)
* ACTION: cwickert to finally send out a mail about LinuxTag
(cwickert, 20:59:06)
* LINK:
https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/LinuxTag_2012#Fedora_Representatives
(cwickert, 21:05:57)
* ACTION: gnokii to send dmaphy tablecloth (cwickert, 21:12:22)
* ACTION: cwickert to disuss the possibility of making new Fedora
shirts with kital (cwickert, 21:17:56)
* ACTION: dmaphy to file a ticket for the banner for Graz ASAP and
directly assign it to somebody who actually has a banner (cwickert,
21:19:46)
* Release events (cwickert, 21:25:51)
* if you are planning a release event, please add it to
https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/F17_release_events (cwickert,
21:27:06)
* ACTION: cwickert to send out a reminder about the F17 release events
(cwickert, 21:27:23)
* release events submission deadline was extended by one week. new
deadline is April 27th (cwickert, 21:28:41)
* Action items form previous meetings (cwickert, 21:30:49)
* ACTION: gnokii to send a mail to the list that we need to collect
all remaining media or at least have an overview what is left and
where (cwickert, 21:32:14)
* Open Floor (cwickert, 21:33:07)
* LINK: http://inode0.fedorapeople.org/swag/fedora-pens.jpg (inode0,
21:43:06)
* the EMEA ambassadors will order to 2k case badges and 2k stickers
with the NA folks (cwickert, 21:53:13)
* ACTION: shaiton_ and cwickert to get quotes for tablecloth
(cwickert, 21:56:22)
Meeting ended at 22:00:23 UTC.
Action Items
------------
* gnokii to make a release event poster and flyer template, color and
b/w. SVG should be fine, then people can still add some text like
date, time and location
* cwickert to finally send out a mail about LinuxTag
* gnokii to send dmaphy tablecloth
* cwickert to disuss the possibility of making new Fedora shirts with
kital
* dmaphy to file a ticket for the banner for Graz ASAP and directly
assign it to somebody who actually has a banner
* cwickert to send out a reminder about the F17 release events
* gnokii to send a mail to the list that we need to collect all
remaining media or at least have an overview what is left and where
* shaiton_ and cwickert to get quotes for tablecloth
Action Items, by person
-----------------------
* cwickert
* cwickert to finally send out a mail about LinuxTag
* cwickert to disuss the possibility of making new Fedora shirts with
kital
* cwickert to send out a reminder about the F17 release events
* shaiton_ and cwickert to get quotes for tablecloth
* dmaphy
* gnokii to send dmaphy tablecloth
* dmaphy to file a ticket for the banner for Graz ASAP and directly
assign it to somebody who actually has a banner
* gnokii
* gnokii to make a release event poster and flyer template, color and
b/w. SVG should be fine, then people can still add some text like
date, time and location
* gnokii to send dmaphy tablecloth
* gnokii to send a mail to the list that we need to collect all
remaining media or at least have an overview what is left and where
* shaiton_
* shaiton_ and cwickert to get quotes for tablecloth
* **UNASSIGNED**
* (none)
12 years
FAmNA Meeting (18 April 2012)
by inode0
======================
#fedora-meeting: FAmNA
======================
Meeting started by inode0 at 01:00:01 UTC. The full logs are available
at
http://meetbot.fedoraproject.org/fedora-meeting/2012-04-18/famna.2012-04-...
.
Meeting summary
---------------
* Roll Call (inode0, 01:00:25)
* Announcements (inode0, 01:03:01)
* NiveusLuna is now old enough to give himself actions (inode0,
01:06:06)
* NiveusLuna is now 24 (NiveusLuna, 01:06:20)
* LINK: https://fedorahosted.org/famna/report/9 (inode0, 01:08:38)
* FAmNA welcomes graphite6 as our newest ambassador :) (inode0,
01:09:01)
* Tickets (inode0, 01:09:48)
* #32 (SELF Brainstorming) – FAmNA general trac -
https://fedorahosted.org/famna/ticket/32 (inode0, 01:10:28)
* LINK: http://duffy.fedorapeople.org/hotdog/ (graphite6, 01:11:03)
* LINK:
http://git.fedorahosted.org/git/?p=beefymiracle.git;a=tree;f=sources
(graphite6, 01:11:20)
* LINK: http://duffy.fedorapeople.org/hotdog/hotdog.svg (graphite6,
01:13:43)
* ACTION: graphite6 will create the button template and get a cost
estimate (graphite6, 01:28:30)
* #33 (2012 Fedora Merchandise Order) – FAmNA general trac -
https://fedorahosted.org/famna/ticket/33 (inode0, 01:30:53)
* Open Floor (inode0, 02:17:02)
Meeting ended at 02:21:35 UTC.
Action Items
------------
* graphite6 will create the button template and get a cost estimate
Action Items, by person
-----------------------
* graphite6
* graphite6 will create the button template and get a cost estimate
* **UNASSIGNED**
* (none)
People Present (lines said)
---------------------------
* inode0 (113)
* nb (53)
* VICODANAX (51)
* graphite6 (47)
* rbergeron (30)
* NiveusLuna (13)
* dramsey (12)
* zodbot (10)
* award3535 (10)
* Sonar_Gal (9)
* StabbyMc_ (9)
* nirik (5)
* Octayn (1)
John
12 years
[EMEA] FUDCon Paris Meeting Minutes
by Kévin Raymond
Hi folks,
Please find bellow the meeting minutes, thanks to all attendees.
http://meetbot.fedoraproject.org/fedora-meeting-1/2012-04-17/fudcon-paris...
================================================
#fedora-meeting-1: FUDCon Paris Planning Meeting
================================================
Meeting started by shaiton_ at 18:03:16 UTC. The full logs are available
at
http://meetbot.fedoraproject.org/fedora-meeting-1/2012-04-17/fudcon-paris...
.
Meeting summary
---------------
* Roll Call (shaiton_, 18:03:32)
* Accommodation status (shaiton_, 18:10:45)
* 50% of the price have to be paid by the 28th of… August. We have
time :) (shaiton_, 18:11:57)
* ACTION: shaiton to see if we can have our NPO on the accomodation
contract (shaiton_, 18:16:22)
* ACTION: shaiton sending back the accomodation contract filled, with
breakfast dropped (shaiton_, 18:16:45)
* there will be free wifi on this hostel (shaiton_, 18:17:50)
* FUDCon date: 13th−15th, accomodation reservations 12th−15th
(morning). People who wish to stay more will have to get back to me
shortly (using the incomming wiki page) (shaiton_, 18:19:45)
* FUDPub status (shaiton_, 18:23:05)
* ACTION: team to see about which menu to choose (shaiton_, 18:27:31)
* ACTION: Bouska to bring beer :) (shaiton_, 18:28:57)
* ACTION: Achrg to see if feasable :) (shaiton_, 18:29:20)
* Schedule proposal (shaiton_, 18:30:34)
* ACTION: to start see about airline discount (shaiton_, 18:31:38)
* ACTION: NOW to book the accomodation (shaiton_, 18:32:17)
* ACTION: SOON to book the FUDPub (shaiton_, 18:32:33)
* ACTION: misc to contact travel agencies (shaiton_, 18:32:44)
* ACTION: to design booklets and tshirt by August (shaiton_,
18:33:44)
* ACTION: to define lunch caterer in May (shaiton_, 18:34:07)
* ACTION: to pay 50% of the accomodation price by the 28th of August
(the whole price by the 27th of Sept) (shaiton_, 18:35:03)
* ACTION: shaiton to fill a wiki page (shaiton_, 18:35:43)
* Ongoing actions (shaiton_, 18:36:48)
* ACTION: shaiton to create the above wiki page (shaiton_, 18:38:35)
* ACTION: shaiton to get back to the OWF organization comitee
(shaiton_, 18:39:45)
* HELP: French people to give Universities contact for our
communication (shaiton_, 18:41:07)
* HELP: to get sponsorts (everyone is welcome to join us in this
effort) (shaiton_, 18:41:49)
* Open Floor (shaiton_, 18:43:56)
* our weekly meetings are on Monday, during the French weekly meeting.
Everyone could ask English questions there during the FUDCon topic.
(#fedora-meeting-1 @ 18:30UTC) (shaiton_, 18:53:57)
* ACTION: team to report on the fudcon-planning mailing list our irl
meetings (shaiton_, 18:54:24)
Meeting ended at 18:57:21 UTC.
Action Items
------------
* shaiton to see if we can have our NPO on the accomodation contract
* shaiton sending back the accomodation contract filled, with breakfast
dropped
* team to see about which menu to choose
* Bouska to bring beer :)
* Achrg to see if feasable :)
* to start see about airline discount
* NOW to book the accomodation
* SOON to book the FUDPub
* misc to contact travel agencies
* to design booklets and tshirt by August
* to define lunch caterer in May
* to pay 50% of the accomodation price by the 28th of August (the whole
price by the 27th of Sept)
* shaiton to fill a wiki page
* shaiton to create the above wiki page
* shaiton to get back to the OWF organization comitee
* team to report on the fudcon-planning mailing list our irl meetings
Action Items, by person
-----------------------
* Achrg
* Achrg to see if feasable :)
* Bouska
* Bouska to bring beer :)
* misc
* misc to contact travel agencies
* **UNASSIGNED**
* shaiton to see if we can have our NPO on the accomodation contract
* shaiton sending back the accomodation contract filled, with
breakfast dropped
* team to see about which menu to choose
* to start see about airline discount
* NOW to book the accomodation
* SOON to book the FUDPub
* to design booklets and tshirt by August
* to define lunch caterer in May
* to pay 50% of the accomodation price by the 28th of August (the
whole price by the 27th of Sept)
* shaiton to fill a wiki page
* shaiton to create the above wiki page
* shaiton to get back to the OWF organization comitee
* team to report on the fudcon-planning mailing list our irl meetings
People Present (lines said)
---------------------------
* shaiton_ (96)
* misc (23)
* zodbot (6)
* Achrg (5)
* jsmith (3)
* Bouska (2)
* Casper_v2 (2)
* nchauvet (2)
* spot (2)
--
Kévin Raymond
(shaiton)
GPG-Key: A5BCB3A2
12 years
Summary/Minutes from today's FESCo Meeting (2012-04-16)
by Kevin Fenzi
===================================
#fedora-meeting: FESCO (2012-04-16)
===================================
Meeting started by nirik at 17:05:17 UTC. The full logs are available at
http://meetbot.fedoraproject.org/fedora-meeting/2012-04-16/fesco.2012-04-...
.
Meeting summary
---------------
* init process (nirik, 17:05:17)
* #833 Clarify provenpackagers communication policy for making changes
to packages (nirik, 17:06:38)
* AGREED: Will add wording about contacting maintainers to
provenpackager policy and announce. (+7) (nirik, 17:10:47)
* ACTION: mmaslano to make change to wiki and announce. (nirik,
17:11:36)
* #830 define requirements for secondary arch promotion (nirik,
17:11:40)
* LINK:
http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Secondary_Architecture_Promotion_Requiremen...
(nirik, 17:11:40)
* AGREED: Defer this issue a week and wait for more feedback/changes
to draft. (+7) (nirik, 17:28:42)
* #829 New proven packagers request: Pavel Alexeev(hubbitus) (nirik,
17:29:16)
* LINK: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/updates/FEDORA-2012-4828 needs
to go stable. (nirik, 17:34:58)
* AGREED: request is approved. (+7) (nirik, 17:36:03)
* Open Floor (nirik, 17:36:09)
* ACTION: mjg59 will chair next week. (nirik, 17:38:58)
* ACTION: nirik to update meeting process page. (nirik, 17:45:10)
Meeting ended at 17:49:01 UTC.
Action Items
------------
* mmaslano to make change to wiki and announce.
* mjg59 will chair next week.
* nirik to update meeting process page.
Action Items, by person
-----------------------
* mjg59
* mjg59 will chair next week.
* mmaslano
* mmaslano to make change to wiki and announce.
* nirik
* nirik to update meeting process page.
* **UNASSIGNED**
* (none)
People Present (lines said)
---------------------------
* nirik (74)
* pjones (22)
* mjg59 (21)
* jonmasters (18)
* t8m (17)
* notting (11)
* bconoboy (11)
* mitr (10)
* limburgher (10)
* mmaslano (9)
* zodbot (7)
* jsmith (2)
* tflink (1)
* sgallagh (0)
--
17:05:17 <nirik> #startmeeting FESCO (2012-04-16)
17:05:17 <zodbot> Meeting started Mon Apr 16 17:05:17 2012 UTC. The chair is nirik. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
17:05:17 <zodbot> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #halp #info #idea #link #topic.
17:05:17 <nirik> #meetingname fesco
17:05:17 <zodbot> The meeting name has been set to 'fesco'
17:05:17 <nirik> #chair notting nirik mjg59 mmaslano t8m pjones sgallagh mitr limburgher
17:05:17 <nirik> #topic init process
17:05:18 <zodbot> Current chairs: limburgher mitr mjg59 mmaslano nirik notting pjones sgallagh t8m
17:05:23 * notting is here
17:05:27 * limburgher is here
17:05:27 <t8m> Hi
17:05:27 <mitr> Hello all
17:05:33 <mmaslano> hello
17:05:33 <nirik> sorry for the delay everyone.
17:06:16 <pjones> hi./
17:06:30 <nirik> ok, shall we go ahead and dive in?
17:06:38 <nirik> #topic #833 Clarify provenpackagers communication policy for making changes to packages
17:06:39 <nirik> .fesco 833
17:06:41 <zodbot> nirik: #833 (Clarify provenpackagers communication policy for making changes to packags) – FESCo - https://fedorahosted.org/fesco/ticket/833
17:06:54 <nirik> mmaslano: you were going to propose/make some wording changes?
17:07:23 <mmaslano> nirik: I'm fine with berrange proposal :)
17:07:35 <mmaslano> I won't correct English speakers ;-)
17:07:38 <mjg59> Hi
17:07:38 <nirik> yeah, seems fine to me too.
17:07:47 <limburgher> Agreed, sane.
17:07:55 <mmaslano> I'll add it to the wiki page
17:08:06 <nirik> +1
17:08:09 <mjg59> Works for me
17:08:24 <mitr> I'm not sure we want it that strict, e.g. for handling urgent issues or mass changes in rawhide preannounced on fedora-devel
17:08:44 <nirik> well, it says "should try"
17:08:48 <mitr> right
17:08:55 <pjones> Well, I wish he'd use the series comma, but sure, that's fine.
17:09:29 <t8m> I think the "should" already includes the common sense "when applicable".
17:09:31 <t8m> so +1
17:09:49 <mmaslano> +1 if voting needed
17:09:54 <mitr> +1 then, we can always weaken it later
17:09:54 <limburgher> +1
17:10:14 <mjg59> +1
17:10:18 <pjones> +1
17:10:37 <notting> +1
17:10:47 <nirik> #agreed Will add wording about contacting maintainers to provenpackager policy and announce. (+7)
17:11:08 <nirik> mmaslano: can you announce the change too? or would you like someone else to?
17:11:24 <mmaslano> nirik: I can send an email to devel
17:11:29 <nirik> thanks.
17:11:36 <nirik> #action mmaslano to make change to wiki and announce.
17:11:40 <nirik> #topic #830 define requirements for secondary arch promotion
17:11:40 <nirik> .fesco 830
17:11:40 <nirik> http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Secondary_Architecture_Promotion_Requiremen...
17:11:41 <zodbot> nirik: #830 (define requirements for secondary arch promotion) – FESCo - https://fedorahosted.org/fesco/ticket/830
17:12:05 <nirik> so, any further feedback here? does anyone have proposed changes?
17:12:26 <nirik> there's 2 things on the discussion tab
17:13:25 <jonmasters> so we will have further feedback, but not today
17:13:34 <notting> i don't think we have an automation framework for image-based installation
17:13:35 <notting> do we?
17:13:48 <jonmasters> notting: in discussion, not currently
17:13:56 <jsmith> notting: We do for EC2 images
17:14:06 <mjg59> jonmasters: We mentioned 2 weeks ago that we wanted to vote on this today
17:14:13 <nirik> there's plans/thoughts of it, but nothing I know of currently.
17:14:13 <jsmith> (assuming you're talking about automation of image creation)
17:14:37 <bconoboy> there's been a lot of feedback on the fedora list, but none of it has gone back into the proposal.
17:14:48 <jonmasters> mjg59: sure, I'm just saying - yea - what bconoboy is saying
17:14:51 <notting> jsmith: no, verification of the results
17:15:07 <mjg59> bconoboy: I really don't think there's been a great deal of substantive feedback that would result in modification, but I may be interpreting the discussions differently
17:15:20 <tflink> notting: we have some install automation in autoqa
17:15:24 <jonmasters> aside from the more straightforward case of qemu, I do have some ideas for how to implement image-based test on PandaBoards and so on.
17:15:27 <mjg59> Let me go back and skim that again
17:15:30 <pjones> bconoboy: what feedback are you thinking there has been that needs to be integrated in?
17:15:47 * nirik personally was -1 for kkofflers proposal/thread.
17:16:03 <pjones> nirik: yeah, I don't think that even really merits a vote
17:16:11 <bconoboy> pjones: for instance, I did an item-by-item discussion and differed on a number of points. some people replied to some, but not all, of htose points- does that mean the things I said that weren't commented on were agreed to?
17:16:11 <jonmasters> agreed
17:16:19 <t8m> nirik, you mean the secondarification of all meaningful architectures? :)
17:16:32 <nirik> t8m: yeah
17:17:09 <pjones> bconoboy: well, I disagreed with the way you were going about it and then you stopped responding. I kindof thought that meant maybe you would bring it up in a different way if you still had objections.
17:17:14 <nirik> we could table this another week and regroup feedback?
17:17:33 <nirik> or discuss feedback to specific parts here / now?
17:17:34 <jonmasters> nirik: I would like that
17:17:40 <jonmasters> (the first)
17:17:41 <nirik> or both.
17:17:42 <mjg59> bconoboy: Ah, I see. I replied to your points, and you never replied - I'd interpreted that as you being happy with my clarifications
17:18:11 <t8m> bconoboy, if you have some concrete proposals to change the draft perhaps we could vote on them one by one?
17:18:25 <bconoboy> mjg59: I just thought you'd be doing another draft. Some points you clarified on list and I Think those should go back into the proposal and that updated proposal should be voted on.
17:18:26 <jonmasters> to me, though, the main two sticking points are anaconda and testing - both of which we have eyes on
17:18:52 <mjg59> bconoboy: Right, I just thought that everything I said was already clear from the language
17:18:59 <pjones> I don't think anaconda is really a sticky point; we're only saying anaconda should be there when we're talking about anaconda-appropriate hardware as the target.
17:19:16 <t8m> pjones, +1
17:19:19 <pjones> bconoboy: I think if you've got specific things you thing should be changed, you should send mjg59 some sample language
17:19:35 <mjg59> bconoboy: Mostly it seemed to be you asking for quantification of things that I don't think can be quantified
17:19:54 <jonmasters> can we ask for another week to collate feedback and straighten out any misscommunications?
17:19:59 <pjones> sure
17:20:02 <mjg59> Sure
17:20:03 <nirik> yeah, I don't think the anaconda requirement should be too much sticking point... there's wording there for resource constrained devices and such
17:20:05 <bconoboy> My general problem with the proposal is that it's even *less* concrete than before. Everything is nebulous and subjective. I think that's fine for an outline, but it isn't really a strategy for promotion. I think the outline is fine.
17:20:31 <pjones> bconoboy: I notice that you have not responded to my email (in response to you) about that.
17:20:32 <mjg59> bconoboy: Every time this has come up we've said that there's no way to provide a set of concrete requirements
17:20:44 <mitr> bconoboy: There just won't be a checklist with each item worth a specific number of points and a minimum number for acceptance.
17:20:45 <bconoboy> But what I'd like to see/hoped for was a description of what the relationship will be between the SA and FESCo/etc for the steps to advance. Right now it's just things that have to be done, but not how to approach them.
17:20:47 <nirik> The problem is I don't think we can make a strict technical requirement list that will result in automatic promotion
17:21:00 <t8m> nirik, +1
17:21:07 <pjones> bconoboy: I think the relationship between SA and fesco is *exactly* what the email I just referenced was about.
17:21:40 <nirik> so, I would urge communcation to keep as open as possible between fesco and arm folks... if one or the other sees something going the wrong way, let everyone know.
17:21:47 <bconoboy> nirik: Okay, I hear the "we can't set it all in stone today"... but a procedure for actually setting things in stone owuld be tremendously useful.
17:22:00 <bconoboy> IE, on a case by case basis. ARM today, $NEWARCH tomorrow
17:22:14 <jonmasters> nirik: completely agree that promotion is never guaranteed or automatic. Brendan is, however, reasonable in wanting more measurable specifics
17:22:20 <mitr> bconoboy: That procedure wouldn't give results any earlier than the vote on making the arcithecture primary.
17:22:21 <pjones> bconoboy: Message-ID: <4F7B1574.3080305(a)redhat.com> if you're looking to read it again.
17:22:22 <nirik> there are non technical issues that we can probibly never quantify.
17:22:23 <mjg59> jonmasters: No, he's not
17:22:30 <pjones> jonmasters: no.
17:22:42 <bconoboy> pjones: I'll go back and reread after this if we're goign to delay vote a week.
17:22:43 <jonmasters> mjg59: well, this is where you and I (shockingly surprising) are going to disagree ;)
17:22:43 <mitr> jonmasters: It's reasonable to want them, but not to expect them :)
17:22:49 <notting> what nirik said. i mean, even if mips hit all the technical points we might set up, i'm not sure i'd see the point of making mips a primary arch
17:23:18 <bconoboy> I hear the voice of FESCo saying no guaranties. That's fine. That's not what I"m talking about right now.
17:23:23 <pjones> jonmasters: as I said in the email - what we need is you to propose plans of how you're going to meet requirements, and us to provide guidance on if we think they're satisfactory or not. we need that level of flexibility if you're going to succeed.
17:23:34 <nirik> right. There may be arches that are technically able to meet these requirements, but due to lack of mindshare, lack of hardware our users could use or other non technical reasons we would never want to promote
17:23:51 <jonmasters> pjones: fine. Ok. To avoid going in circles, give us a week to regroup on this and give you some more meat to chew on next Monday.
17:23:58 <bconoboy> What I'm saying is that the proposal isn't procedural, it's just some notions of what must be done, it lacks the structure of how to approach the undertaking. That's what I'm looking for.
17:24:00 <mjg59> If you have a plan that sounds like it meets all of the reqirements we provide, then the overwhelming probability is that the architecture will be promoted
17:24:24 <pjones> bconoboy: see that email. really.
17:24:28 <mjg59> And we can spend a short period of time going back and forth to make sure that those plans match everyone's expectations
17:24:33 <jonmasters> bconoboy: I think the onus on us is to say for e.g. "here's how we will handle testing", etc.
17:24:39 <pjones> jonmasters: exactly.
17:24:42 <bconoboy> pjones: okay, looking it up now
17:24:52 <nirik> for example, I suspect ppc / s390 could perhaps meet those technical requirements, but I don't think they have enough mindshare or hardware our users could ever use to make it worth making them primary.
17:25:11 <jonmasters> pjones: I do get you, I understand what you're asking for, and that is reasonable. It it is also, eventually, reasonable to agree on a less nebulous list. But we need to get you more meat before you can do the same for us.
17:25:34 <limburgher> Right, FESCO needs final say. But I think it's reasonable to put out there what we want to see before we'll look at it.
17:26:14 <pjones> jonmasters: that may well be true. time will tell ;)
17:26:34 <jonmasters> ok, we'll get you a list of points kinda related to the ones on the draft. E.g. putting forward representation, how we'll handle builds, how we'll get board access to developers, how we'll test, etc.
17:26:45 <mjg59> #proposal Defer for another week to allow concrete change proposals
17:26:46 <nirik> proposal: agreed: defer a week for more discussion and feedback on draft.
17:26:52 <mjg59> +1
17:26:54 <notting> well, if they want one more week to respond, i'm fine with that. it's not like we have a time pressure for this yet. +1
17:26:57 <nirik> +1 here as well.
17:26:59 <limburgher> +1
17:27:12 <t8m> +1
17:27:15 <pjones> jonmasters: just as a point, though, it'd be good if you guys responded by, say, friday morning, so we could have some discussion /before/ the fesco meeting monday
17:27:21 <jonmasters> notting: and in fairness, there isn't time pressure per se. We want to do this /right/, not in a rush. If need be, it's F19 or whatever.
17:27:29 <pjones> jonmasters: that'd help move the discussion along more easily
17:27:34 <mitr> +1, just to keep this on agenda - I don't think it makes much difference whether the proposal is voted on
17:27:35 <jonmasters> pjones: that is a reasonable request. I apologize for not doing so properly before.
17:28:19 <jonmasters> Brendan has done an excellent job, some us need to make time to assist further, and this will happen before next week's meeting.
17:28:26 <mmaslano> +1
17:28:42 <nirik> #agreed Defer this issue a week and wait for more feedback/changes to draft. (+7)
17:29:10 <nirik> thanks for the input jonmasters and bconoboy
17:29:16 <nirik> #topic #829 New proven packagers request: Pavel Alexeev(hubbitus)
17:29:16 <nirik> .fesco 829
17:29:17 <zodbot> nirik: #829 (New proven packagers request: Pavel Alexeev (hubbitus)) – FESCo - https://fedorahosted.org/fesco/ticket/829
17:29:38 <nirik> This was formerly a sponsorship request... he's asked for provenpackager to work on ImageMagick updates.
17:30:08 <notting> and now a meeting item due to not enough responses to that in ticket
17:30:29 <notting> in fact... no parseable yay/nay responses.
17:30:35 <t8m> so I stick with my previous opinion and give him +1
17:30:48 <nirik> I was thinking they could just request co-maintainer on those packages, but I suppose the set changes and could be a pain to get approved on all of them.
17:31:17 <limburgher> Yeah, it's a lot, given that it's ImageMagick.
17:31:25 <mitr> +1, in general I prefer having provenpackager quite open, and dealing with problems if they come
17:31:31 <mmaslano> I'm also for +1, he's doing packaging for a long time
17:31:38 <limburgher> +1
17:31:53 <notting> i'd be fine with it - +1
17:32:01 * nirik is a very weak +1 I guess. I still have the same concerns as on the sponsorship... communication needs to improve, etc.
17:32:25 <nirik> any other votes?
17:32:40 <mjg59> I'm ok with +1
17:32:51 <limburgher> nirik: Agreed, but again, it's ImageMagick, if there's a problem, A: we'll know and B: it's early in f18.
17:33:18 <nirik> limburgher: well, there's still a problem in f17 isn't there? or did that get fixed.
17:33:39 <nirik> no, it's still there.
17:33:58 <pjones> I really don't have an opinion
17:34:02 <limburgher> nirik: What still needs to happen to fix it?
17:34:58 <nirik> https://admin.fedoraproject.org/updates/FEDORA-2012-4828 needs to go stable.
17:35:14 <nirik> some dependent packages have already done so, but lack the ImageMagick package update
17:35:27 <nirik> or perhaps they haven't been rebuilt yet. not clear
17:35:45 <nirik> anyhow...
17:36:03 <nirik> #agreed request is approved. (+7)
17:36:09 <nirik> #topic Open Floor
17:36:16 <nirik> any items for open floor?
17:37:15 * nirik listens to the silence.
17:37:24 <nirik> oh, chair next week?
17:38:15 <nirik> don't all jump up at once... ;)
17:38:22 <mjg59> I'll do it
17:38:27 <mjg59> Been a while
17:38:58 <nirik> #action mjg59 will chair next week.
17:38:59 <nirik> thanks.
17:38:59 <t8m> I saw the mail on devel that we should establish a single chair due to inconsistencies in the mailing of FESCo meeting minutes :)
17:39:25 <t8m> anybody wants to be a chair for the whole term? :D
17:39:44 <nirik> I think as long as we all follow the process page it should be fine.
17:39:57 <t8m> people make mistakes :D
17:40:06 <nirik> I think adamw was just being grumpy in the middle of beta testing. ;)
17:40:33 <pjones> he's got a valid point, but I'm not sure it's quite a strong as he's making it sound :)
17:40:45 <t8m> sure, I see it that we just should be more careful in following the process page
17:40:55 * nirik nods.
17:41:07 <nirik> or clarify the process page if it's unclear in any places.
17:42:01 <t8m> nirik, I have the problem with sending the draft schedule
17:42:18 <t8m> nirik, not many people want to do it on Sundays
17:42:26 <nirik> yeah...
17:42:33 <nirik> perhaps we should make it send on friday?
17:42:38 <nirik> previous 'business' day
17:42:40 <limburgher> not a bad idea.
17:42:42 <mitr> sounds like the obvious answer
17:42:54 <t8m> nirik, +1, will you change the process page?
17:42:59 <nirik> but it also is sometimes hard to remember to do that so far in advance.
17:43:03 <nirik> sure, I can.
17:43:09 <nirik> if everyone is ok with that change?
17:43:11 <t8m> nirik, yeah
17:43:20 <mmaslano> sure
17:43:25 <notting> sure
17:43:45 <mjg59> I think that's reasonable
17:43:49 <nirik> we seldom add things over the weekend anyhow...
17:43:55 <mjg59> Especially because anything tagged over the weekend is unlikely to get read beforehand
17:44:51 <pjones> This is one of the big downsides to having the meeting on monday
17:44:57 <nirik> yeah.
17:45:10 <nirik> #action nirik to update meeting process page.
17:46:19 <nirik> ok, any other open floor items?
17:47:16 * nirik will close the meeting in a minute if nothing else.
17:48:59 <nirik> ok, thanks for coming everyone!
17:49:01 <nirik> #endmeeting
12 years
Docs meeting summary -- 16 April 2012
by Ben Cotton
Meeting summary
---------------
* Roll Call (bcotton, 14:01:29)
* Release Notes (bcotton, 14:04:37)
* LINK: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Release_Notes_schedule
(bcotton, 14:04:48)
* Guide Status (bcotton, 14:09:14)
* LINK:
http://rbergero.fedorapeople.org/schedules/f-17/f-17-docs-tree-tasks.html
(bcotton, 14:09:22)
* it appears POTs are due to translation by next Monday (bcotton,
14:10:17)
* Live Images Guide and Burning ISOs have been updated for F17
(bcotton, 14:10:49)
* Release Notes redux (bcotton, 14:13:00)
* ACTION: randomuser to file a bug against RN for user-mounted media
or just add the content (bcotton, 14:21:25)
* Outstanding BZ Tickets (bcotton, 14:25:22)
* LINK: http://tinyurl.com/lbrq84 (bcotton, 14:25:35)
* Open floor discussion (bcotton, 14:26:47)
* Open Help Conference (bcotton, 14:33:36)
* LINK:
http://lists.fedoraproject.org/pipermail/docs/2012-April/014169.html
(pkovar, 14:34:48)
* LINK:
http://lists.fedoraproject.org/pipermail/docs/2012-April/014169.html
(bcotton, 14:35:26)
* Open Help Conference is Aug 11-15 in Cincinnati, OH (bcotton,
14:36:13)
Meeting ended at 14:47:25 UTC.
Action Items
------------
* randomuser to file a bug against RN for user-mounted media or just add
the content
Action Items, by person
-----------------------
* randomuser
* randomuser to file a bug against RN for user-mounted media or just
add the content
People Present (lines said)
---------------------------
* bcotton (45)
* jjmcd (34)
* randomuser (21)
* pkovar (11)
* zodbot (3)
* Capesteve (3)
* Southern_Gentlem (1)
* claneys (1)
Minutes:
http://meetbot.fedoraproject.org/fedora-meeting/2012-04-16/fedora_docs.20...
Minutes (text):
http://meetbot.fedoraproject.org/fedora-meeting/2012-04-16/fedora_docs.20...
Log:
http://meetbot.fedoraproject.org/fedora-meeting/2012-04-16/fedora_docs.20...
--
Ben Cotton
Fedora Docs Leader
12 years
