10:31 a.m.
I'm running an actual install of F37. I have had this experience twice
now. I run the updates in a virtual console using dnf, they
complete successfully, they have a firmware package among the updates.
I then start X to run LXDE, and it starts without complaint. But when
I try to run either nightly from /usr/local or firefox from /usr/bin in
a terminal, they start and just hang. There are no messages in the
journal or in the terminal, and when I look at them using ps they are
in interruptable sleep.
In both cases, I killed them, and exited X, restarted X, and tried to
run them again. No change. But, when I reboot the computer,
everything starts working again the way I would expect; firefox starts.
Is this a change in F37 that requires a reboot after the install of
firmware packages? I know that Gnome, and I think KDE, now require a
reboot after every update. Has it moved to other desktops? Can I
turn it off, if it has? Is there a command I can run from the command
line to do the equivalent of a reboot? Or is it all just coincidence,
and there is another reason?
12:36 a.m.
New subject: F37 seems to require a reboot after updates of firmware packages
in order for firefox to run.
On Thu, Aug 18, 2022 at 5:32 PM stan via test <test(a)lists.fedoraproject.org>
wrote:
I'm running an actual install of F37. I have had this experience
twice
now. I run the updates in a virtual console using dnf, they
complete successfully, they have a firmware package among the updates.
I then start X to run LXDE, and it starts without complaint. But when
I try to run either nightly from /usr/local or firefox from /usr/bin in
a terminal, they start and just hang. There are no messages in the
journal or in the terminal, and when I look at them using ps they are
in interruptable sleep.
In both cases, I killed them, and exited X, restarted X, and tried to
run them again. No change. But, when I reboot the computer,
everything starts working again the way I would expect; firefox starts.
Is this a change in F37 that requires a reboot after the install of
firmware packages? I know that Gnome, and I think KDE, now require a
reboot after every update. Has it moved to other desktops? Can I
turn it off, if it has? Is there a command I can run from the command
line to do the equivalent of a reboot? Or is it all just coincidence,
and there is another reason?
I can't speak to your particular experience, but updating the system
without restarting is unreliable by design (no matter the desktop). If you
really want to avoid restarting (I don't recommend it), you can install
python3-tracer and then run "sudo tracer -ea". It will try to list all
processes which need to be restarted, because their corresponding files
changed on disk due to the update. If you see anything listed in the
output, you're in a potentially unsafe state. It is just a heuristic,
though, it can't detect everything.
8:31 a.m.
New subject: F37 seems to require a reboot after updates of firmware
packages in order for firefox to run.
On Fri, 19 Aug 2022 07:36:24 +0200
Kamil Paral <kparal(a)redhat.com> wrote:
I can't speak to your particular experience, but updating the
system
without restarting is unreliable by design (no matter the desktop).
If you really want to avoid restarting (I don't recommend it), you
can install python3-tracer and then run "sudo tracer -ea". It will
try to list all processes which need to be restarted, because their
corresponding files changed on disk due to the update. If you see
anything listed in the output, you're in a potentially unsafe state.
It is just a heuristic, though, it can't detect everything.
I shutdown and restart the system every day, so I want to avoid
another. What strikes me about this is that it suddenly started
occurring after years of no issues. That is what led me to believe
that there was a change that caused this. It also happened again
today, without a firmware update, blowing my theory out of the water.
Since it is only firefox, at least I think it is only firefox, perhaps
it is something in firefox that has changed. Arguing against that is
that it was a system version of firefox that hadn't changed that
suddenly stopped working. There was an update to systemd about the time
this started, and that is pervasive on the system, perhaps it is
causing it somehow.
I have been running updates without rebooting and without issue for
years, so while I know there is a theoretical possibility of issues, I
think it has to be a very rare occurrence. Especially without the
desktop running. I'll just switch to updating before I shut down for
the day. And / or update less frequently than daily.
Thanks.
8:45 a.m.
New subject: F37 seems to require a reboot after updates of firmware
packages in order for firefox to run.
On Fri, 19 Aug 2022 06:31:36 -0700
stan <upaitag(a)zoho.com> wrote:
New development. I decided to run strace on the process to see if it
would give any useful information. And the program started! That
makes it look like there might be a race happening, with strace slowing
things down enough that it didn't occur.
A workaround of sorts. :-)
2:19 p.m.
New subject: F37 seems to require a reboot after updates of firmware
packages in order for firefox to run.
On Fri, 19 Aug 2022 06:45:14 -0700
stan <upaitag(a)zoho.com> wrote:
On Fri, 19 Aug 2022 06:31:36 -0700
stan <upaitag(a)zoho.com> wrote:
New development. I decided to run strace on the process to see if it
would give any useful information. And the program started! That
makes it look like there might be a race happening, with strace
slowing things down enough that it didn't occur.
A workaround of sorts. :-)
This became more common, and strace sometimes worked and sometimes not.
But what works every time is to start chromium, then close it. After
that, nightly starts every time. There must be a missing library or
setting that chromium sets up, and then firefox can use it. I haven't
looked further.
4 a.m.
New subject: F37 seems to require a reboot after updates of firmware packages
in order for firefox to run.
Hello Stan,
I do not experience this behaviour with Fedora 37. The only thing that
happens to Firefox is that
*it requires to be restarted* when the application gets an upgrade using
the DNF way.
In that case, I hit "Restart Firefox" button that comes with the message
and my Firefox closes and reopens in the couple of seconds and I am using
its newer version without the need to restart the whole machine.
I never upgrade via Software because it takes so long and needs restarting.
On Thu, Sep 22, 2022 at 9:20 PM stan via test <test(a)lists.fedoraproject.org>
wrote:
On Fri, 19 Aug 2022 06:45:14 -0700
stan <upaitag(a)zoho.com> wrote:
> On Fri, 19 Aug 2022 06:31:36 -0700
> stan <upaitag(a)zoho.com> wrote:
>
> New development. I decided to run strace on the process to see if it
> would give any useful information. And the program started! That
> makes it look like there might be a race happening, with strace
> slowing things down enough that it didn't occur.
>
> A workaround of sorts. :-)
This became more common, and strace sometimes worked and sometimes not.
But what works every time is to start chromium, then close it. After
that, nightly starts every time. There must be a missing library or
setting that chromium sets up, and then firefox can use it. I haven't
looked further.
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9:58 a.m.
New subject: F37 seems to require a reboot after updates of firmware
packages in order for firefox to run.
On Fri, 23 Sep 2022 11:00:55 +0200
Lukas Ruzicka <lruzicka(a)redhat.com> wrote:
Hello Stan,
I do not experience this behaviour with Fedora 37. The only thing that
happens to Firefox is that
Must be something on my system or in my configuration. It only started
within the last few months. There have been massive updates to F37,
and firefox has moved 2 versions, so hard to track down.
*it requires to be restarted* when the application gets an upgrade
using the DNF way.
In that case, I hit "Restart Firefox" button that comes with the
message and my Firefox closes and reopens in the couple of seconds
and I am using its newer version without the need to restart the
whole machine.
I never upgrade via Software because it takes so long and needs
restarting.
Yeah, I'm strictly dnf as well. But I usually do my dnf updates in a
console without the GUI running, so that might be part of the problem.
X is started with startx, and without a greeter / desktop manager, and
there might be some dependency on that. It isn't such a hardship, but
I'll keep watching to see if I can find a cause. It only occurs after
updates, a cold start never has issues, and without updates I can stop
and start X without any issue as well.
573
days inactive
609
days old
6 comments
3 participants
participants (3)
-
Kamil Paral -
Lukas Ruzicka -
stan