As I was going through some email this morning I saw that the Spins SIG is concerned that the Cloud SIG hasn't followed the Spins process to get their "ec2" labeled Spin included in the spins-kickstart collection in git:
http://lists.fedoraproject.org/pipermail/spins/2011-March/001734.html
If the Cloud group needs to see this Spin included in the F15 release, then my recommendation is to start talking with the Spins SIG about the process. I believe there's a deadline that's passed, although you can request an exception and still make it into the release.
To the Spins SIG, I would also recommend keeping lines of communication open if something goes wrong. A Cc: to the cloud@ list, for example, would help raise the issue to more people in a way that would help reach a solution faster.
On Tue, Mar 01, 2011 at 08:47:50 -0500, "Paul W. Frields" stickster@gmail.com wrote:
As I was going through some email this morning I saw that the Spins SIG is concerned that the Cloud SIG hasn't followed the Spins process to get their "ec2" labeled Spin included in the spins-kickstart collection in git:
http://lists.fedoraproject.org/pipermail/spins/2011-March/001734.html
If the Cloud group needs to see this Spin included in the F15 release, then my recommendation is to start talking with the Spins SIG about the process. I believe there's a deadline that's passed, although you can request an exception and still make it into the release.
To the Spins SIG, I would also recommend keeping lines of communication open if something goes wrong. A Cc: to the cloud@ list, for example, would help raise the issue to more people in a way that would help reach a solution faster.
Robotics may also fall into this category as well. They contacted us a while back, but at the time we weren't functioning so getting them approved was a problem. They are also a feature.
I am not sure if either group is looking to have an ISO produced or just have their kickstart file included in one of the spin-kickstarts package.
The existing spins also need review. Some don't seem to be getting maintenance, and at least design suit does follow the guidelines and should be fixed, dropped or given an exception.
I sent invites to both the cloud list and the robotics list to have reps attending the upcoming Spins SIG meetings.
On Tue, Mar 01, 2011 at 08:47:50AM -0500, Paul W. Frields wrote:
As I was going through some email this morning I saw that the Spins SIG is concerned that the Cloud SIG hasn't followed the Spins process to get their "ec2" labeled Spin included in the spins-kickstart collection in git:
http://lists.fedoraproject.org/pipermail/spins/2011-March/001734.html
If the Cloud group needs to see this Spin included in the F15 release, then my recommendation is to start talking with the Spins SIG about the process. I believe there's a deadline that's passed, although you can request an exception and still make it into the release.
To the Spins SIG, I would also recommend keeping lines of communication open if something goes wrong. A Cc: to the cloud@ list, for example, would help raise the issue to more people in a way that would help reach a solution faster.
I suppose if that is what needs to be done, it can be. In all honestly it never crossed our minds because we didn't seek to be a "spin", but that is where releng wanted to put our kickstart. If it makes sense to be labelled as a spin, I am happy to do that. I am ill today, but will look a the spin process as soon as I get a chance.
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On 03/01/2011 09:57 AM, Justin M. Forbes wrote:
On Tue, Mar 01, 2011 at 08:47:50AM -0500, Paul W. Frields wrote:
As I was going through some email this morning I saw that the Spins SIG is concerned that the Cloud SIG hasn't followed the Spins process to get their "ec2" labeled Spin included in the spins-kickstart collection in git:
http://lists.fedoraproject.org/pipermail/spins/2011-March/001734.html
If the Cloud group needs to see this Spin included in the F15 release, then my recommendation is to start talking with the Spins SIG about the process. I believe there's a deadline that's passed, although you can request an exception and still make it into the release.
To the Spins SIG, I would also recommend keeping lines of communication open if something goes wrong. A Cc: to the cloud@ list, for example, would help raise the issue to more people in a way that would help reach a solution faster.
I suppose if that is what needs to be done, it can be. In all honestly it never crossed our minds because we didn't seek to be a "spin", but that is where releng wanted to put our kickstart. If it makes sense to be labelled as a spin, I am happy to do that. I am ill today, but will look a the spin process as soon as I get a chance.
I think this is where the confusion comes. I would like to see spin-kickstarts become the place to store "blessed kickstart files", maybe with a change of names. These kickstarts can be used to create different kinds of livecds. Some of these are spins, but some of these could be used as the basis for others building appliances or cloud images.
On Tue, Mar 01, 2011 at 11:07:42 -0500, Daniel J Walsh dwalsh@redhat.com wrote:
I think this is where the confusion comes. I would like to see spin-kickstarts become the place to store "blessed kickstart files", maybe with a change of names. These kickstarts can be used to create different kinds of livecds. Some of these are spins, but some of these could be used as the basis for others building appliances or cloud images.
There is a mechanism to do this already. The QA test day spin is an example of that. I agreed to work with the QA guys with this so that they didn't need to worry about some of the spin process but could still have a more convenient way for them to make spins for test days. These spins go into the custom folder.
On Tue, 01 Mar 2011 11:07:42 -0500, Daniel J Walsh dwalsh@redhat.com wrote:
I think this is where the confusion comes. I would like to see spin-kickstarts become the place to store "blessed kickstart files", maybe with a change of names. These kickstarts can be used to create different kinds of livecds.
I suppose an even more appropriate term is 'images' - to reflect the fact the installation media kickstart as well as the AOS and EC2 kickstarts would be in the repository.
-- Jeroen
On Tue, Mar 1, 2011 at 8:47 AM, Paul W. Frields stickster@gmail.com wrote:
As I was going through some email this morning I saw that the Spins SIG is concerned that the Cloud SIG hasn't followed the Spins process to get their "ec2" labeled Spin included in the spins-kickstart collection in git:
I've talked to Dennis about this already, and this was simply a miscommunication on his part.
As we're moving towards having Koji generate the release images for EC2, he needed a place to store the EC2 kickstart file so that it was public and being tracked in revision control, and so that Koji could pull the kickstart file when it generated the images. As I understand it (and I'm sure Dennis will correct me if I'm wrong), Koji can either pull from packages.fedoraproject.org or from the spins git repo. So, to make a long story short, Dennis put the EC2 kickstart file in the spins git repo out of convenience. He wasn't trying to say that EC2 was a spin.
I've got to admit that I never saw the EC2 images as being a spin per se, but that's certainly a discussion we can have going forward. As I re-read through the Spins guidelines, it's still not clear to me how this would even qualify as a spin -- it's really a different animal than our traditional spins. At the same time, I think it needs a lot of the same process for review, oversight, and QA that we currently have in place for spins, so there might be some ability to roll the cloud images into the spins concept. I'm certainly open to comments and suggestions either way.
-- Jared Smith Fedora Project Leader
On Tue, Mar 01, 2011 at 11:20:52AM -0500, Jared K. Smith wrote:
On Tue, Mar 1, 2011 at 8:47 AM, Paul W. Frields stickster@gmail.com wrote:
As I was going through some email this morning I saw that the Spins SIG is concerned that the Cloud SIG hasn't followed the Spins process to get their "ec2" labeled Spin included in the spins-kickstart collection in git:
I've got to admit that I never saw the EC2 images as being a spin per se, but that's certainly a discussion we can have going forward. As I re-read through the Spins guidelines, it's still not clear to me how this would even qualify as a spin -- it's really a different animal than our traditional spins. At the same time, I think it needs a lot of the same process for review, oversight, and QA that we currently have in place for spins, so there might be some ability to roll the cloud images into the spins concept. I'm certainly open to comments and suggestions either way.
Agreed, we certainly will not be creatin ISOs or any other installable image eiether, but I am open to discussions there. Review is important, which is why we are trying to make images available throughout the F15 release process.
As for a git repository, the kickstart files are currently being maintained in git://git.fedorahosted.org/cloud-kickstarts.git This doesnt work wth koji at the moment, but it is a place for people to read/comment/suggest changes and check out to create their own appliances.
On Tue, Mar 01, 2011 at 11:20:52AM -0500, Jared K. Smith wrote:
On Tue, Mar 1, 2011 at 8:47 AM, Paul W. Frields stickster@gmail.com wrote:
As I was going through some email this morning I saw that the Spins SIG is concerned that the Cloud SIG hasn't followed the Spins process to get their "ec2" labeled Spin included in the spins-kickstart collection in git:
I've talked to Dennis about this already, and this was simply a miscommunication on his part.
As we're moving towards having Koji generate the release images for EC2, he needed a place to store the EC2 kickstart file so that it was public and being tracked in revision control, and so that Koji could pull the kickstart file when it generated the images. As I understand it (and I'm sure Dennis will correct me if I'm wrong), Koji can either pull from packages.fedoraproject.org or from the spins git repo. So, to make a long story short, Dennis put the EC2 kickstart file in the spins git repo out of convenience. He wasn't trying to say that EC2 was a spin.
I've got to admit that I never saw the EC2 images as being a spin per se, but that's certainly a discussion we can have going forward. As I re-read through the Spins guidelines, it's still not clear to me how this would even qualify as a spin -- it's really a different animal than our traditional spins. At the same time, I think it needs a lot of the same process for review, oversight, and QA that we currently have in place for spins, so there might be some ability to roll the cloud images into the spins concept. I'm certainly open to comments and suggestions either way.
OK, thanks for this explanation. At the time it wasn't clear why the kickstart file was coming to the spins-kickstart repo. If there was a need for it to be there, then I wanted to see the teams involved get into a conversation about it.
On Tue, 1 Mar 2011 11:20:52 -0500, "Jared K. Smith" jsmith@fedoraproject.org wrote:
I've got to admit that I never saw the EC2 images as being a spin per se, but that's certainly a discussion we can have going forward. As I re-read through the Spins guidelines, it's still not clear to me how this would even qualify as a spin -- it's really a different animal than our traditional spins.
If by 'traditional spins' you are referring to optical live media, sure I understand how it's a different animal.
However, I fail to see how the EC2 spin is different from the currently included AOS spin. Should you have included the AOS spin in the consideration causing you to label the EC2 image a different animal, I'm interested in what exactly you consider different about it.
Thanks in advance,
Kind regards,
-- Jeroen
On Tue, Mar 1, 2011 at 5:47 AM, Paul W. Frields stickster@gmail.com wrote:
As I was going through some email this morning I saw that the Spins SIG is concerned that the Cloud SIG hasn't followed the Spins process to get their "ec2" labeled Spin included in the spins-kickstart collection in git:
http://lists.fedoraproject.org/pipermail/spins/2011-March/001734.html
If the Cloud group needs to see this Spin included in the F15 release, then my recommendation is to start talking with the Spins SIG about the process. I believe there's a deadline that's passed, although you can request an exception and still make it into the release.
To the Spins SIG, I would also recommend keeping lines of communication open if something goes wrong. A Cc: to the cloud@ list, for example, would help raise the issue to more people in a way that would help reach a solution faster.
At today's Spins SIG meeting the EC2 image came into question again. Whether it is a true spin or not, they would still like to see it go through the parts of the spin process [1] that are applicable to it so we can at least get on their radar and start figuring out what is and is not important to do. In particular, they asked for a wiki page that is marked as ready for the spins wrangler some time this week. Any thoughts? Volunteers?
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Bruno Wolff III -
Daniel J Walsh -
Garrett Holmstrom -
Jared K. Smith -
Jeroen van Meeuwen -
Justin Forbes -
Paul W. Frields