On Wed, 17.07.13 14:36, Denys Vlasenko (dvlasenk@redhat.com) wrote:
instead of administrators simply adding rsyslog or syslog-ng manually at install time or to their ks snippets.
And this too was answered several times already. The machine in question may be already borked. Our support people will need to figure out - over the phone or email! - what has happened on client's installation, and having traditional grep/sed/awk recipes not working anymore because /var/log/messages is not there anymore is an extremely unwelcome discovery in an emergency.
You guys aren't administrators who are dealing with these problems every day. You don't feel the pain you create for other people.
Again:
"cat /var/log/messages" becomes "journalctl" "tail -f /var/log/messages" becomes "journalctl -f" "tail -n100 /var/log/messages" becomes "journalctl -n100" "grep foobar /var/log/messages" becomes "journalctl | grep foobar"
This isn't complex. You can grep/sed/awk as much as you want. You just do it over the output of journalctl rather than teh file. That's not that big a difference.
And if you really need it as a file, you can do "journalctl > /var/log/messages", and have it in a file. And if that doesn't cut it and you want something that is "living", then install rsyslog and you got the real /var/log/messages back.
and quite frankly administrators that complain about journal have not actually tried it and experienced the flexibility the journactl gives them it truly is not as bad as some people are trying to make it out to be.
False argument. People (on this thread) aren't complaining about journactl being a bad thing. They are complaining about /var/log/messages disappearing.
It's only disappearing as a file, it is not disappearing as a text format. "journalctl" has that, and thanks to the power of unix pipelines you can make use of that pretty much in the sam ways in grep/sed/awk as the text file itself.
Lennart