On Mon, 2010-03-15 at 10:01 +0100, Christoph Wickert wrote:
Am Sonntag, den 14.03.2010, 22:58 +0100 schrieb Martin Sourada:
On Sun, 2010-03-14 at 14:07 -0700, Steven I Usdansky wrote:
F13 updated with updates-testing 2010-03-14 15:52 CDT (UTC -5) An annoying little bug - lxdm and lxde-common for F13 both require desktop-backgrounds-compat-9.0.0-11.noarch which requires constantine-backgrounds-single. BZ time?
~$ rpm -q --whatrequires constantine-backgrounds-single desktop-backgrounds-compat-9.0.0-11.noarch
The -compat package is supposed to be rebuilt with each Fedora release and needs is dependencies changed for the default theme of the new release. At least this is how it has worked (or not worked) in the past. But the desktop-backgrounds package is not really actively maintained, for F12 I had to step in to do the changes.
~$ rpm -q --whatrequires desktop-backgrounds-compat lxde-common-0.5.0-1.fc13.noarch lxdm-0.1.1-0.2.20100303gite4f7b39.fc13.i686
That might indicate that lxde requires some extra effort to get the new backgrounds default and no-one has done the work yet.
Nobody has bothered to tell us about any new backgrounds. Are there any general changes or are we just talking about a new -compat package?
BTW: This applies to Xfce too, xfdesktop also uses the symlink /usr/share/backgrounds/default.png.
Well, if you need only this symlink and if it's in -compat it's just as easy as pointing the symlink to /usr/share/backgrounds/goddard/default/standard/goddard.png
and requiring goddard-backgrounds-single
Cheers, Martin
PS: Chris, if you wish to be more informed about backgrounds changes (since F12 we are pushing the new backgrounds since Alpha) feel free to ask on design team mailing list (design-team AT lists.fp.o) or tell us there how/where/when would you like to be notified about the change. I usually prepare some basic stuff for gnome and kde myself (the packaging work) and then just ping the gnome and kde folks to change their defaults to the new one. The KDE folks are also deriving their artwork (KDM etc) from ours so they usually are following more closely directly on our list.
Am Montag, den 15.03.2010, 10:57 +0100 schrieb Martin Sourada:
On Mon, 2010-03-15 at 10:01 +0100, Christoph Wickert wrote:
BTW: This applies to Xfce too, xfdesktop also uses the symlink /usr/share/backgrounds/default.png.
Well, if you need only this symlink and if it's in -compat it's just as easy as pointing the symlink to /usr/share/backgrounds/goddard/default/standard/goddard.png
and requiring goddard-backgrounds-single
I know, I did it in the F12 release cycle too, although it's not my package. The package has 17 maintainers (!) but nobody seems to care about it. So I just stepped up another time and did the update for F13/Goddard.
PS: Chris, if you wish to be more informed about backgrounds changes (since F12 we are pushing the new backgrounds since Alpha) feel free to ask on design team mailing list (design-team AT lists.fp.o) or tell us there how/where/when would you like to be notified about the change. I usually prepare some basic stuff for gnome and kde myself (the packaging work) and then just ping the gnome and kde folks to change their defaults to the new one. The KDE folks are also deriving their artwork (KDM etc) from ours so they usually are following more closely directly on our list.
Sorry if this may sound impolite, but I don't think it's on my to ask the design team. Usually the maintainers who change something are to notify the maintainers of the affected packages. So when Goddard becomes default, the person doing this change should ping desktop-backgrounds-owner@fpo.
In a perfect world (tm) I wouldn't need to care about this because my packages only require desktop-backgrounds-compat but not goddard-backgrounds. But the world is not perfect, so feel free to also notify lxde-common-owner, lxdm-owner and xfdesktop-owner just as you did this time. Would be nice to be notified a little earlier next time.
Regards, Christoph
On Thu, 2010-03-18 at 15:39 +0100, Christoph Wickert wrote:
Am Montag, den 15.03.2010, 10:57 +0100 schrieb Martin Sourada:
On Mon, 2010-03-15 at 10:01 +0100, Christoph Wickert wrote:
BTW: This applies to Xfce too, xfdesktop also uses the symlink /usr/share/backgrounds/default.png.
Well, if you need only this symlink and if it's in -compat it's just as easy as pointing the symlink to /usr/share/backgrounds/goddard/default/standard/goddard.png
and requiring goddard-backgrounds-single
I know, I did it in the F12 release cycle too, although it's not my package. The package has 17 maintainers (!) but nobody seems to care about it. So I just stepped up another time and did the update for F13/Goddard.
Thanks :)
Sorry if this may sound impolite, but I don't think it's on my to ask the design team. Usually the maintainers who change something are to notify the maintainers of the affected packages. So when Goddard becomes default, the person doing this change should ping desktop-backgrounds-owner@fpo.
Depends... The design team is in charge of actually creating the new backgrounds and it's only our good will that we also do the packaging (well, we've been doing it for the past 4 or so releases, so it practically is our task to make the package as well). Making it default is IMHO task for respective spin owners / SIG members. It's easier for them to read around the Alpha freeze the fedora weekly news' artwork section than for the design team to keep in mind which spins are using the default wallpaper, and which have their own and which packages needs the changes to use the new default.
I wonder what might be the best way to handle this. Certainly, now that I know about that lxde and xfce are just using whatever is in d-b-compat, I can include you and the d-b, lxde-common, lxdm na xfdesktop owners in my notify list (or even ask for commit rights on d-b and do the change myself)... But as this happens twice in a year, I always forget about these things... Maybe a wiki page where the spin authors / desktop manager maintainers would express their needs regarding the handling of changing default wallpaper would help.
In a perfect world (tm) I wouldn't need to care about this because my packages only require desktop-backgrounds-compat but not goddard-backgrounds. But the world is not perfect, so feel free to also notify lxde-common-owner, lxdm-owner and xfdesktop-owner just as you did this time. Would be nice to be notified a little earlier next time.
I'll try ;-)
Anyway, I'm open to suggestions how to make the process better.
Thanks, Martin
Am Donnerstag, den 18.03.2010, 21:41 +0100 schrieb Martin Sourada:
The design team is in charge of actually creating the new backgrounds and it's only our good will that we also do the packaging (well, we've been doing it for the past 4 or so releases, so it practically is our task to make the package as well).
Sorry, but whoever does the packaging clearly is in charge of notifying the other maintainers, see https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Package_maintainer_responsibilities#Notify_ot...
Making it default is IMHO task for respective spin owners / SIG members. It's easier for them to read around the Alpha freeze the fedora weekly news' artwork section than for the design team to keep in mind which spins are using the default wallpaper, and which have their own and which packages needs the changes to use the new default.
I might be wrong but AFAIK all the spins (should) use the default artwork. So it should be pretty easy to ping everybody. And if a spin doesn't use the default artwork (KDE?), then there is no reason for the spin maintainers to get notified. Or am I mistaken here?
I wonder what might be the best way to handle this. Certainly, now that I know about that lxde and xfce are just using whatever is in d-b-compat, I can include you and the d-b, lxde-common, lxdm na xfdesktop owners in my notify list
It should be sufficient to just use desktop-background-owner but I don't mind also having lxde-common-owner and xfdesktop-owner as fallback.
(or even ask for commit rights on d-b and do the change myself)...
This might be even better since none of the 17 maintainers of desktop-backgrounds seems to really care about the package.
But as this happens twice in a year, I always forget about these things...
Same here ;)
Anyway, I'm open to suggestions how to make the process better.
Hey, it was not that bad, at least it has worked better than last year. In F12 I had to do the update after beta freeze, so there definitely was an improvement. ;)
Thanks, Martin
Thanks for all your hard and excellent work. I appreciate what you do for Fedora very much.
Regards, Christoph
On Thu, 2010-03-18 at 22:49 +0100, Christoph Wickert wrote:
Am Donnerstag, den 18.03.2010, 21:41 +0100 schrieb Martin Sourada:
The design team is in charge of actually creating the new backgrounds and it's only our good will that we also do the packaging (well, we've been doing it for the past 4 or so releases, so it practically is our task to make the package as well).
Sorry, but whoever does the packaging clearly is in charge of notifying the other maintainers, see https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Package_maintainer_responsibilities#Notify_ot...
Well, technically speaking, it's not a change that breaks anything -- it's new package with wallpapers that's *prepared* to be the new default. And to be fair, I'm not 100% sure, who's in charge of actually changing the default wallpaper...
Making it default is IMHO task for respective spin owners / SIG members. It's easier for them to read around the Alpha freeze the fedora weekly news' artwork section than for the design team to keep in mind which spins are using the default wallpaper, and which have their own and which packages needs the changes to use the new default.
I might be wrong but AFAIK all the spins (should) use the default artwork. So it should be pretty easy to ping everybody. And if a spin doesn't use the default artwork (KDE?), then there is no reason for the spin maintainers to get notified. Or am I mistaken here?
KDE uses default artwork, just as Desktop (but they have different infrastructure for wallpapers than gnome does...). IIRC, e.g. the Education or Security Spins have customized wallpapers (created by the design team as well, though :D) as defaults. But it seems sane to suppose that "plain" spins (i.e. Desktop (Gnome), KDE, LXDE, XFCE and such) would use the default artwork... The spin owners who have customized wallpapers ask for a new one when they would like to change it.
Anyway, I'm open to suggestions how to make the process better.
Hey, it was not that bad, at least it has worked better than last year. In F12 I had to do the update after beta freeze, so there definitely was an improvement. ;)
Yeah, the process is improving on our side of things as well (and especially co-working with KDE SIG has been really smooth these past few releases). I don't recall of us ever having such great wallpaper done already for Alpha! Although, there seems to be lack of people commenting on it...
Thanks, Martin