Marc Wiriadisastra wrote: I am not sure associating being searched more to better is the right idea. We have had seen similar discussions on google trend search results too but I cant find out any common agreement on what that really means. Rahul

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Marc Wiriadisastra escribió: In my opinion Ubuntu is more targeted towards the new users, it has many functions "dumbed" down for users, even if these "simplifications" come at the cost of security (sudo, anyone?), and it has also a large userbase because of this. Fedora on the other hand, is more targeted toward the "enthusiastic" users or "Linux power users" (without it being Debian). Also Ubuntu has a larger lifespan than Fedora, alas, (if I understand correctly) Ubuntu has releases in concordance with major GNOME releases, even if these are Ubuntu beta releases. I'm not sure that the focus of Fedora is to directly compete against Ubuntu as such, especially for new Linux users, however, derivative works could be done to produce a Fedora derivative distribution geared toward directly competing against Ubuntu (as in if it not being Fedora as such, could use Fedora's resources like the Extras, Livna, etc repositories). Linux can be as media focused as Apple's Mac OS X is, however there is one major encumbrance: patents and closed formats. As with any other platform is not the platform itself, but its applications, what grants the focus and/or userbase.

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Rahul escribió: I know there are better models, even the PAM access controls I first ever saw in Red Hat impressed me quite a bit, starting graphically an administrative tool, and have the root password prompt is and was awesome. However either more and more admin tasks have a graphical frontend to use the same model or other model should be put in place altogether... Like PolicyKit, as you mention. And I'm doing my part. I have helped a lot of my friends and family to migrate to Linux using Fedora as the path, I won't deny that at first, especially with Yarrow and Tettnang Fedora kept its "elitist" approach of being an enthusiast-only distro. Still I introduced it to a great many people and thankfully, many of them are still using it. I understand this, but only a couple months ago I helped upgrade a friend to Core 5 from Core 3, and the main reason for the update was that there are no officially endorsed OpenOffice.org 2.0.x packages for Core 3 or any of the Legacy maintained distros, for that matter. Today I'm upgrading my home server to Core 5 too from Tettnang, because I want to use official packages like PHP 5, more recent MySQL builds, etc, on it. This is what I meant by lifespan. Having security updates and bugfixes is good, and OK, but without the benefits from newer versions of the programs, you are pretty much "forced" to upgrade to a new version pretty much as soon as your current distro is moved to Legacy. I'm not asking for this to change, after all I knew that this was going to be the case with Fedora, as it IS part of what makes Fedora, Fedora. But I wanted to point out that in the case of Ubuntu, for its users the greater lifespan is good, as they have upgrades, updates and bugfixes heavily worked on for 18 months, before a distro upgrade. In the case of Fedora this is at most for 12 months before moving into Legacy; and even then, some times even when the next version is released the prior automatically stops getting new versions of programs and is stalled. Not that this is 100% true, but it is for quite a bit of packages (glibc, gcc, etc, etc), but at least in the case of GCC this can induce serious problems. Historically and traditionally Fedora is not to be used on "production environments" as it being a community driven distro and the "playground for RHEL", serves more to test a particular or group of technologies to be included in RHEL (I KNOW that is not the case, but until recently that was the general perception of Fedora amongst Linux savvy users), however I'm glad that Fedora has started to have a life of its own and is less and less tied to RedHat in terms of the direction the distribution as a whole is taking and letting the community more and more participate on it. I'm glad that Fedora is less and less seen as the "Red Hat's community pet project" and more as what it really is: A community driven project. Still some users feel "distant" from the project and don't know how to get involved on it (I know I felt that way for some time). In general I think Fedora has made some real strides into changing how the community perceives the project and to redefine itself. So it is actually good to know the clarification that Fedora actually is heading in a direction where it'd be in direct competition with Ubuntu in the good sense, as competing to one-another will only lead to positive things on both sides and to improve the user experience with both distributions, which in the end will reflect on more Linux users... That can only be a good thing in my book.

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Rahul escribió: My point being that as soon as any version of Fedora is moved to Legacy, the updates seem to stall, and only bugfixes and security updates are made for those distros, i.e no more updated packages (like the case of OOo 2.0 for Core 3, even when it was still "current" when Stentz had OOo 2 and Heidelberg stalled at 1.1.3), I didn't think OOo was a core component. Certainly that's why a newer version is made available. However as soon as a new version is released, and before the "current" one is moved to Legacy, many updates stall and only security fixes and bug fixes are issued, at least for packages in Core, while Extras still undergo heavy updating. I know a lot of distributions don't keep in sync with the upstream packages, if any, I'd guess only Fedora and Gentoo do that anymore. For Ubuntu, I guess is more like it was with the old Red Hat, not being as current but heavily worked on. Which is why newer versions of the distro as a whole are made available every ~6 months... maybe only thing missing is yum upgradeablity through from version to version, but that's been previously discussed, and while feasible, it would also mean a lot of left overs,which could or not get in the way of operation.

Marc Wiriadisastra wrote: ... From what I see, the most impressive feature in Ubuntu seems to be its hype making machine. Or should I say the fanboy recruiting machine? This is a department where historically Fedora and Red Hat does not shine (even Novell is louder here). I do not know to what degree this is intentional (maybe the desire to not create unfounded expectations), but it certainly fired back in the early days of Fedora. It seems to improve, but very slowly. -- nicu Cool Fedora wallpapers: http://fedora.nicubunu.ro/wallpapers/ Open Clip Art Library: http://www.openclipart.org my Fedora stuff: http://fedora.nicubunu.ro

Nicola Losito wrote: Are you willing to contribute? http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Websites/PloneToDo Rahul